1 877-431-4276Buddy Bell | How to Build the Helps Ministry in Your Church
Buddy Bell loves being the “Pastor’s Friend.” He is the world’s foremost expert on helping churches to build their ministry of helps. His passion is to activate the body of Christ to serve. If you need help training your ushers, greeters, or your nursery workers, Buddy Bell is the minister to call.
Learn more about Buddy Bell’s Ministry: https://mohi.org/
Buy Buddy Bell’s Book on the Ministry of Helps:
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
Dr. Buddy Bell loves being the pastor’s friend. He is the world’s foremost expert on helping churches to build their ministry, of helps. His passion is to activate the body of Christ to serve. If you need help training your ushers, your greeters, or your nursery workers, Buddy Bell is the minister to call.
Evangelism Podcast Host (00:39):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast with Dr. Daniel King, where Daniel interviews full-time evangelists, pastors, missionaries, and normal everyday Christians to discover how they share their faith, their powerful testimonies, and amazing stories that will inspire you to reach people with the good news. And now, here’s your host, missionary, and evangelist Daniel King.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:04):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King, and I’m excited about telling people about Jesus. And today I have a great friend with me, Dr. Buddy Bell. Thank you so much for joining me on the Evangelism Podcast.
Buddy Bell (01:19):
Good to be here, Daniel.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:20):
Well, you and I have been friends for quite a while now. And the thing that I love about your ministry is that you love helping churches help people. Amen. And building the helps ministry. So tell me, how did you get started in helping churches build their helps ministry?
Buddy Bell (01:42):
Well, I think the big thing was realizing that I was in the ministry of helps. You know, my wife and I were involved in church and, and back then, no one had ever heard of the Ministry of Helps. And we were you know, people would say we were strange, we were weird, we were different. They told us, you know, God broke the mold when he made us. And I remember one day in church on Sunday morning, my pastor at that time opened up the first Corinthians chapter 12 verse 28. And he began to read it. It says, in God has set some in the church. And I thought, well, you know, that’s where I want to be. I want to be in church. I just don’t want to go to church. And it goes on. It says, first apostles, secondary prophets.
(02:31):
Thirdly, teachers after that miracles, then gifts of healings. And then he said, helps. And he stopped. And for 60 seconds, he expounded on the ministry of helps. And I sat there in church with tears in my eyes, and I said to myself, you know, buddy, you’re not weird. You’re not strange. You’re not different. And God didn’t break the mold when he made you, but the mold is still in the Bible. And I found my place that day in church. I was in the ministry of helps. And and so that began to, you know, develop on the inside of me. I be begin to s you know, seek more information on the ministry of helps. And because, you know, like one Mr said to me, you know, people want to see their place in the Bible. You know, am I on the team or am I just sitting in the grandstand watching the game?
(03:33):
People want to be in the game. You know, am I really important? You know, my, my greatest reward, I guess traveling and teaching on the ministry of helps is, and I’ll never forget her, this nursery worker walked up to me and she had tears running down her cheeks. And she, she said, you know, brother Bell, I really didn’t thank God, knew I was back there in their nursery. And I’ll never forget her. And, you know, and, and people think that, well, you know, I, I just work in the nursery, or I’m just an usher, or I’m just a, a greeter, or I, I just do what Pastor once done. And they don’t realize how valuable and how important they are. I mean, if it wasn’t important, then why did God, that created the heavens in the Earth set into the church helps. You know, there, there’s a rumor going around the world today that, that Buddy Bell made up this ministry of helps.
(04:32):
I didn’t make it up. I read my Bible, you know, and I, and I see I have a part in the body of Christ. I’m valuable. I’m important, you know the definition. Now, if I get preaching, we’re gonna take an offering <laugh>. Okay? But the definition for the ministry of helps is the Greek definition. It’s as one of the administrations in the local church by way of rendering assistance, or especially of help minister to the weak and the needy. So if you’re rendering assistance in any way in the church, if you’re giving help to the weak and the needy, you’re operating in this supernatural ministry. The ministry of helps. Now, listen to me, it’s a ministry as just as valid, just as anointed as if God had asked you to be a prophet. I think I heard an amen out there. Amen. Maybe a couple amens out there.
(05:25):
Amen. Why? Because God is not a respecter. We’re in this thing together. You know, I thank God for prophets, but also thank God for nursing workers and ushers and greeters. You know, I’ve <laugh>. I’ve had people, when I get done ministering on helps will take me off to the side. I don’t know how many times this happened. And they say, now, brother, buddy, I want to ask you a question, but I want you to be honest with me. Like I’ve been lying to ’em the whole time. You know? And they, but I want you to be honest. Nobody’s around, you know, but you’re really not that excited about nursery workers, are you? I say, excuse me, I’m gonna back up. The wrath of God is coming in here. You know? And, and I see it on people’s faces when I’m teaching on the ministry of helps. You know, do, do, do you really believe that brother buddy? Well, let, let me help you out. When I look at a nursery worker, I don’t see a nursery worker. I see Jesus. When I look at an usher, I don’t see an usher. I see Jesus. When I look at a prophet, I don’t see a prophet. I see Jesus. And that’s why I can be excited about every member and every part of the body. Cause I’m excited about Jesus. Amen. All right.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (06:41):
Amen. Amen. Let you do something. Well, I think your perspective is so valuable, cuz sometimes when people think about being in ministry, the picture that comes to mind is the fivefold ministry gifts. You got the apostle, the prophet, the evangelist, the pastor, the teacher, and they envision a platform ministry where someone’s up on the platform. And, and a lot of people are actually scared to do public speaking or get on a platform. They, so they say to themselves, oh, I could never be in ministry. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But what you’re saying is that you can totally be in ministry by finding a place to serve in the house of God. Amen. And by helping out with what needs to be done, because the pastor is not the only one called to serve the Lord. Every single believer can find a place to help in the body of Christ. Amen. Would you say that’s
Buddy Bell (07:35):
True? Daniel? You used the word just a moment ago that I don’t use. Okay. And because it’s a word that causes division within the body, and that word is fivefold. I don’t believe in the fivefold. Okay. You can’t find it in the Bible, that word. You know? And so I tell people, I’m in the sevenfold now I’ve got you on that one. Cause seven is God’s number and what’s the other two helps in governments. But then that don’t leave anybody out. Okay. And so, I, I I don’t use that word fivefold. Okay. And because when you said it, you know, there was a division there, you had a group that was up on the platform, and then the rest of of us over here, you know, we all want, we’re all, we’re all in this together, you know? And so you know, I, I just don’t use that word, <laugh>.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (08:29):
All right. Well, I will amend my vocabulary. Yeah. And, and I actually agree with you. I, I think helps is a, an extremely valuable ministry in the church. All right? So let’s say you, you go into a church, right? And you’re, you’re helping their, helps ministry, challenging people to serve the Lord with excellence. I’ve heard you talk some about King Solomon and the excellence that his helpers serve the Lord with. Talk. Talk to us a little bit about that.
Buddy Bell (09:00):
Yeah. When the Queen of Sheba and from Ethiopia visited her, him, you know I point out the things that she noticed, okay? And you know, a lot of, a lot of times we don’t realize when people walk into the church that they see things and they’re moved by what they see. Okay? She was moved by what she saw. She saw the food the, the, the meat on the table. She saw her, the building. She saw the ministers and their apparel, the cup bears and their apparel, the way he carried himself in, up into the house with the Lord. You know, 85% of communication is done through body expression. You know, you ever had anybody ask you, Hey, what’s wrong? And they go, well nothing. Well, you need to tell your face cuz your face is telling everybody that there’s something wrong. You know? And so, you know, I, I talk about ushers, that they affect people’s giving by the way. They, they come down the aisle with the buckets. You know some of ’em look like they’re in a funeral. You know,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (10:08):
If an usher is me, no one wants to put anything in that offering bucket right here. Throw, put your, put your offering in there.
Buddy Bell (10:15):
Right? And, and, and some do that, some think, well, maybe we shouldn’t be taking an offering right now. They don’t have to say nothing. You can see it, you know, when a pastor has to coax them to come down for the offering, okay, we’re, we’re gonna have an offering here. Okay. You know, God loves a cheerful giver, a hilarious giver. Gonna need some ushers ushers Fred come on down, Fred. Come on, Fred. You, you can help out. You know? And, and, and like, we’re trying to coax them in, into giving, okay? When they ought to come down for smile on their face. Well, Daniel, how come they don’t smile when they come down? I’ll tell you why. They’re not givers themselves. I wouldn’t have a non-GI person as an usher in the church. A actually, I wouldn’t have a non tither as an usher.
(11:04):
What, what, what an honor to stand up and say, now we’re getting ready to take your offering. And these people that are serving as ushers, they’re all tithers in the church. Wow. You know, had, have one usher said to me, well, you better not look at the, at the giving records, you know, if I’m a Tyler or not. I said, listen, sheep are not dumb. I said, we don’t need to look at the records to see if you’re a ti or not. We have our ways of finding out, you know, when we’re down at, I help afterwards, you know, we’ll bring up tithing and notice how quick you change the subject.
(11:40):
So we, we, we don’t need to look at the books. We’re all in this together. We all have a part. We’re all, we’re all valuable. We’re all important. The ushers, the greeters. I’ve seen people get at the door when they walked in. I saw this one gentleman when the greeter reached out to grab him, and he fell on his knees. He said, my God, I need Jesus. Well, doesn’t he know he is gotta wait till the end of the service? That’s when we give the altar calls at the end. You know, first church I was involved in our attitude in the ministry of helps us. We’re going to get everybody saved. Everybody healed. Everybody set free before church. And if we miss any em, pastor can pick, pick him up at the end. But in a lot of churches is well, they see how many pastor can pick up at the end.
(12:29):
You know, where we, you know, were, we were, we were evangelizing at the door and the nursery, you know I tell a story, you’re gonna get me going on the stories here. A mother came to the nursery and worker and said I just wanna know something. What did you do to my baby last Sunday? I, I, I, when I picked up my, my baby and I took her home and I put her in the, in her bed, she immediately went to sleep. She never goes immediately to sleep. What did you do to my baby? And so the, the nursery worker had an opportunity to share Jesus with her. She went out front at, in the service, and at the end, she raised her hand and got saved. Now, was it the sermon or was it the, the nursery worker that realized, this is not a babysitting service back here, but this is a ministry. And she ministered to that mother that morning, and that’s why she got saved.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (13:31):
Yeah. When you think about a new visitor who comes to a church, Uhhuh, <affirmative>, he drives into the parking lot. He sees the parking lot attendant. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> helps him park his car. Then he walks in the front door, there’s a greeter there. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And then an usher helps the person to find a seat. Maybe if they have kids, they go drop their kids off at the nursery or mm-hmm. <Affirmative> in the children’s ministry. So they’re looking around trying to figure out where they’re supposed to take their kids. Yeah. Finally, they, they get in, they’re the, the usher helps them find a seat. And people are there and, and say, Hey, that’s my seat. I sat in that pew every Sunday. What are you doing sitting in my seat? Right? But, and then somebody greets the crowd, and then you have the praise and worship team get up, and then maybe someone receives the offering. And you can be 30, 40 minutes into the church service before they ever see the pastor, hear the pastor. And probably by that time, they’ve already decided whether they like the church or not, whether that would be the type of church that they would want to be a member at.
Buddy Bell (14:35):
Right. The experts say that first time visitors will determine within the first six to seven minutes if they’re going to return or not to that church. And who do they meet in the first six or seven minutes?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (14:49):
Usually not the pastor. He’s back there in the, the green room on his face before God praying, probably. Yeah.
Buddy Bell (14:56):
They meet, they meet the parking lot attendant who park it over here. Stay between the lines. Grab your kids’ hands. We need speed bumps out here, nursery, I don’t know where the nursery’s at. Find somebody’s got a baby and follow them. And then they walk in and they see the greeter, you know shake hands with the people in front of ’em there and hug them. But when they walk to the door, the, the greeter just happened to turn and not shake their hand or greet them, you know? And then they go on down the hall and they go to the nursery after they find it, you know? And the nursery worker looks at him and said, oh, no. And not another one. Man, I need some help back here. I hope you brought some clean diapers. I mean, you know, some people bring their babies in here and they don’t bring extra diapers, and they expect us to supply them extra diapers.
(15:48):
And then they, they leave there and they, they go down to the, the youth room. And the youth leader comes out and said, oh, you’re new. Well let me explain some things that go on down here in the youth ministry. We cast out devils down here, and if your little boy’s got a devil, we will cast it outta him. And then they come on down the hall and, and they walk into the sanctuary. Now I’m talking about typical churches. Okay? And they walk in the sanctuary, and the ushers and the elders are holding up the back wall, you know, for six days. And six nights. The back wall stands by itself, but it becomes a seventh day. It takes all the ushers and all the elders to hold up the back wall, you know? And, and they just say, well, just, just find a chair somewhere, you know? And so they go, they, they sit down, you know? And and then they watch the, the worship team and the, and the musicians. They’re up there arguing which song they’re gonna sing. Now, would you go back to that church? Would you go back to that church?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (16:52):
Not that church. No. Actually, I probably preached to that church one time.
Buddy Bell (16:56):
<Laugh> <laugh>. I’ve been in a lot of those churches. You know, I, I have, I’ve been in a lot of those churches. But what if, what if they walk in or drive into the parking lot and, and the parking lot attendance out there. He’s got a smile on his face. He welcomes them to the church, you know, and it says, Hey, you know, the door is right over here. You know, the greeters are at there. They’ll help you if you got questions. They’ll show you where all, where your children need to go. And the greeters there got a smile on their face, you know, they find out they’re new. See, greeters should be walking information booths, you know. So they take that family and they take them down to the nursery. They introduce ’em to the nursery worker and let ’em know that they’re new here.
(17:41):
You know? Then they take ’em down to Children’s Church and they let ’em know that they’re new. And then they take ’em up to the sanctuary and tell the usher, these, these people are new. Well, knowing that the usher’s gonna make sure that they have a real good seed up front so they can see everything, hear everything that God wants for them to hear, you know, tells ’em more about the church, tells ’em to get excited. You know, our pastor’s been into Word, he is been teaching this series. I mean, it’s really, the people are really excited. Now, you tell me you’re gonna come back to that church.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (18:14):
That sounds like a great church to go to.
Buddy Bell (18:16):
And there are churches like that. Yeah. There are churches that like that. And and so
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (18:21):
And so when you go into a church and they’ve asked you to, to help their ushers, help their greeters, what are some of the things that you say to them to, to help them to be the very best ushers and greeters and ministers that they can be?
Buddy Bell (18:40):
Well, the most important thing, again, is to show them and teach them about the Ministry of Alps. Once, you know, it’s hard to teach someone something if they don’t realize how important it is. And they are okay. And so, you know, the, the f the very first thing is to teach them, you know, the importance of the ministry of helps. But also, you know, I’m not just there for people that are serving, but the leaders need to understand it. Okay? People never go beyond their leadership. However, the leadership is in the church. That’s the way the people will be. You know, a a lot of times it, it’s not the people’s fault, you know? Pastor said, well, I can’t get anybody involved. Well, my first question is let me talk to your leaders. Do they believe in the ministry of Hels?
(19:42):
You know, do they realize how valuable the people are? You know, that their ministry is a, is a supernatural ministry. Do they understand that? You know, and so, I, I always say, let me talk to your leaders. You know, let me, let me minister to your leaders and show to them how valuable the ministry of helps is, and that it’s an important ministry. You know? And they need to get that across, you know, <laugh>, you I had a a minister years ago when I was young. And he asked me, he said, brother Bell, you ever listen to yourself preach? I said, oh, no, no, no, no. He says, you need to listen to yourself. Preach. There’s two attitudes in preaching. There’s a want to attitude and a half, two attitude. He says, we all know we have to. He said, but Brother Bell, what’s missing in people is the want to, you know, we tell ’em, you have to be saved.
(20:44):
You have to, you know receive Holy Spirit. You, you have to, you have to. You have to. When we ought be saying to, no, you want to get saved, you want Jesus in your life. You want to serve God, not you have to serve God. You know? No. You want to serve God. You want to be every, everything that God wants you to be. You wanna do all that God wants you to do. You know? And, and that’s what’s missing before a lot of people. And so, you know, that’s one of my main goals when I go into a church, you know, is put the want to back into people because they, all they’ve been hearing is the have to, you know, when I go to a church, I guarantee a pastor. I guarantee him that 10% of the people that are in front of me will step out and want to serve God that have never served God before.
(21:39):
I guarantee it. It happens everywhere I go. If there’s a thousand people in front of me, over a hundred will come forward. That’ll want to serve God. People want to serve God. And you’ll never talk me out of this. Every Christian, every Christian, deep in their heart desires to serve God, but they’ve never been told, you know, that cleaning the church being a greer, being an usher, going on an evangelism trip with Daniel King Ministries, you know, and carrying your bags, you know, helping to set up the, the music the sound, you know, at, at your meetings. It’s a ministry. It’s a ministry. It’s just as important as you standing up there and ministering the gospel of those people. Because if you had to go and do everything that you just did, that happened in your trip in Ethiopia, y you wouldn’t have done it.
(22:37):
You, you, you couldn’t have done it. Okay? But you had a lot of people around you, a lot of people doing other things, you know, and they weren’t in front of the people. Okay? But they’re valuable, and they’re important, you know, every member, every part of the body, you know, no matter where it is, okay? You know <laugh>, if I was to reach inside of you right now and pull out a part of you and showed it to you, you know how you would react? You would react. Like some people, some people react when they see people that walk in the church. Oh, no, what’s that? You know, where did that come from? But if I told you it came from you, what would be your first response?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (23:22):
I need that.
Buddy Bell (23:23):
Right. Put it back. Put that
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (23:25):
Liver back. I need that
Buddy Bell (23:26):
Liver. Yeah. You didn’t ask. Yeah, but you didn’t ask me what it was. You didn’t ask me how important it was. You didn’t ask me how it helped other parts of my body. But when you found out that it was part of you, all you knew was it must be there for a reason. It must be there for a purpose. And that’s the way everybody is in church. You’re there for a reason. You’re there for a purpose. Maybe I don’t understand you. Okay? I don’t realize right now how important you are, but you’re part of the body, and I need every part of the body.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (24:03):
Yeah. When we were just in Ethiopia, one of the most important team members we had was, was someone who was just taking pictures. Yeah. Because without those pictures, you can’t tell the story back home of everything that, that God did. And so I had a, a wonderful man of God who came and, and he was just servant taking pictures and mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, you’d never taken pictures before. But I put a camera in his hands, I think God can use you. And he, he captured some good ones. And then thinking about Ethiopia, they traced their spiritual heritage back to the Queen of Sheba. Yeah. And so, the, the fact that to this day in Ethiopia, there are people that credit their spiritual heritage all the way back to the impression that the Queen of Sheba had with the, the people that attended to King Solomon. It shows the importance of the ministry of helps.
Buddy Bell (24:55):
Yeah. When I was my teaching that I do called winning first time visitors, and I talk about the Queen of Sheba and everything that she noticed, you know, and while she was there, there was a, a young lady that was sitting on the front row. I was in San Francisco, and she was really into this teaching. I, she was saying, Hey man, she was rocking back and forth in her chair, you know? And so when I got done, she walks up to me and she says, brother, buddy I don’t know if you noticed this, but I was really into your teaching day. I said, well, yeah, it was pretty noticeable. She says, you know why I said, no, why I am from Ethiopia. And the Queen Shiba was responsible for bringing the teachings of God to our country. And that’s why I got all excited about that. Amen. But I, I, I teach that. I’ll go into a church to show everybody just how valuable and how important they are. Let me let’s see if we can find it here somewhere in my Bible.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (26:01):
I like your Bible. It’s full of marks all over the place. You know what they say? Dirty Bible, clean living, clean bible, dirty living. Yeah.
Buddy Bell (26:09):
But I, I wanna, it’s falling apart. And I, I’m wanting to go get a new Bible and but it’s all marked up, you know? And you know, so I don’t know what I’m gonna do. But you know, one of the things that you know, I tell people this now. I, I say this, curiosity is the number one evangelism tool in a local church. People think that they’ve got, you know, people say, well, you know, I, I, I can’t get people to come to church. Well, you just told me something. You don’t talk about your church outside of the four walls. I said, you know, you don’t have to preach the people to get ’em to come to church. You don’t have to quote scripture. You don’t have to act spiritual around. Just talk about your church. Talk about what’s going on, what’s God is doing in your church.
(27:05):
Cause sooner or later, their curiosity is going to peak. Okay? And, and what’s go, what happens to ’em is the same thing that happened to the Queen of Sheba. She says, how be it, I believe not their words, until I came and my eyes had seen it. And behold, the one half of the greatness of thou wisdom was not told me for the exceeded the fame that I had heard. So somebody was talking outside of the four walls, you know, and she’ll, she, she said, well, I just got to go see it with my own eyes. But there was something else that she experienced, okay, while she was there that she would not have experienced if she hadn’t went. She says, happy are thy. Amen. And happy are these I servants with stand continually before the they hear thy wisdom. The spirit of the place touched her, even though she saw all these different things.
(28:04):
Okay? It was the spirit that was, everybody was happy. And then she said, blessed be the Lord I God. Now I tell people she got saved. Now I know nobody can get saved in the Old Testament, but it’s a type in the shadow of the new. She said, there is a God. Now, I don’t believe an unsafe person should have to go to church five or six times to realize that there is a God. They can realize it in their very first visit, just like the Queen of Sheah. And then she makes his statement, this confession. She says, blessed be the Lord thy God, which delight indeed set the only throne to be king for the Lord thy God, because I God, love Israel to establish them forever. Therefore, many king over them do judgment and justice. What a statement. From a first time visitor, there is a God, you’re a man of God. This is the house of God. God’s hand is upon you in her first visit. And I’ve seen that happen with other people that, that it just, when they walked in and just realized there is a God. But what would happen if they had to go through that parking lot, attendant that was grumpy, the greeter that didn’t greet them, the nursery worker that told ’em off the, the usher looked like, looked at him like, what are you doing here?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (29:31):
You think the usher that didn’t us.
Buddy Bell (29:33):
Yeah. Right. You’d think they, that, that there is a God in Israel. And then she writes a check for 130 million and dropped it in the bucket. I tell churches, you need money. There’s no telling how many Queen of Shebas have walked into your church, could have wrote you one check and paid for everything. But they thought, you know, it’s kinda like this. I asked people that, that invest in stock. Do you just ran randomly pick a stock and invest in it? No. You, you, you find out about that company and if you’re gonna invest a lot of money, you go and you visit that, that company, you want to meet the employees. You want to meet the, the, the up in the office area, you know, the executives. Cause you’re getting ready to put a bunch of money into that. Well, it’s the same way in church. Some people wonder why people aren’t giving well. Cause they, this don’t look like a good company to invest in.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (30:38):
Yeah.
Buddy Bell (30:39):
Now you got me preaching
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (30:40):
<Laugh>. Well, you’ve written some great books on the ministry of helps on ushering, on greeting, just different ways to, to help churches with the, the helps ministry. And on your website you also have some online courses that can help train churches in these different areas. They could sit all their ushers and greeters down and they could go through some of your material. And you’ve also traveled and spoken at over 3000 churches, which is an amazing statistic. Yeah. Helping a lot of different churches from every different type of denomination. So if someone wants to find out more about you, they want to buy one of your books, go through one of your courses, or maybe even invite you to come to their church. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, what is your website that they can find out more information about you? Well,
Buddy Bell (31:34):
They can number one, they could type in Buddy Bell in any search engine. Okay. It’ll come up.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (31:41):
You know, I did that earlier. Some baseball player came
Buddy Bell (31:44):
Up. Yeah. Me and the baseball player. Yeah. People always ask me, are you Buddy Bell, the baseball player? I said, no, gimme a dollar. You know, I tell everybody, you gotta gimme a dollar. If you think I’m Buddy Bell, the baseball player, and he has four daughters and I have four daughters. You know, I, I wonder if people ever ask him, are you Buddy Bell, the preacher? You know, but
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (32:02):
Yeah. So type in Buddy Bell, the ministry of Helps and you’ll come
Buddy Bell (32:07):
Right up. Yeah, you can do that. Yeah. Or go to mo i.org that stands for Ministry of Helps international.org or Buddy Bell Ministries. Okay. And you know, I went 21 years straight every weekend for 21 years. Wow. And
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (32:26):
That’s
Buddy Bell (32:27):
Amazing. I’ve never written a letter. I’ve never called a pastor cold Turkey and asked for a meeting. Never. And they still keep coming in. You know, Fred Price said something one time at, at Bible’s. He says, you know, if you’ve got a word from God, God will open the doors. I remember sitting there thinking, oh, come on now, how they gonna know unless I hound them on the phone? You know? And, but it’s true. I’ve got the, one of the littlest words in the Bible, and it’s opened over 3000 doors around the world. We’ve been in 29 countries. And right now I met a gentleman, oh, about 30 years ago the International School of Ministry, Baron Gland. Today, every year he was telling me between two to 300,000 people around the world will hear my teachings on the ministry of helps in 150 nations in over 80 different languages.
(33:28):
They hear the teaching on the ministry of helps. And and so I remember before the internet, the Lord spoke to me and said, you know, you’re gonna be on the staff of thousands of churches around the world. And I thought, well, you know, that’s gonna take a lot of money to do that. You know, but one day I get a phone call from Baron Gland, and I’ve never met, met him before. He says, I’m in Tulsa, I like to take you to lunch. I thought, Hey, free lunch, I’ll go. And he says, I, I’m setting up these Bible schools in local churches. And he says, I like to use some of your your teachings that was on VHS tapes. And I said, sure. And today it’s in a, they’re in 150 nations around the world. Wow. 80 different languages. And so yeah, we have a book, the books we also have ’em in Spanish we’re working on French coming out because we have 10 teachings that come in, what we call the School of Helps.
(34:41):
School helps, has 10 teachings 10 30 minute teachings with notes and quizzes and discussion questions. That’s in English. It’s in Spanish. And just a few weeks ago they converted it into French. Wow. And and so get ahold of us. Yes, I I love traveling. I love coming in the churches. Doesn’t matter what size they are. I’ve been in churches that run 30,000 and I just came from a church that had 15 on Sunday morning. Doesn’t matter. You know I love it, Daniel. I love what I do. I love it. And I love to see people light up and realize, you know, if Jesus comes back and I’m in the nursery, he’s gonna let me in. If Jesus comes back and I’m an, I’m out in the parking lot, he’s gonna let me in. Cause we’re all valuable.
(35:42):
We’re all important. And, and I can’t leave without doing this. So let me give you one more definition. This was, this is becoming pretty famous around the world. It’s by a man by the name of God Bay. He was a Pentecostal Holiness preacher back in the 18 hundreds. And he wrote a commentary on the New Testament. And this is how he defines the ministry of helps. He starts off with the word o h o. It’s not, oh, that’s how simp some people respond to rendering assistance. But he’s excited. He starts off, oh, the infinite value of the humble gospel helpers. Thousands of people have no gifts as leaders are number one helpers. How Grand revival work moves along When, when Red the heart platoons a fire baptize helpers crowd around God’s heroic leaders of the embattled hosts.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (36:41):
Woo. That’s powerful
Buddy Bell (36:43):
<Laugh>. What a definition for a dirty diaper changer. Amen. <laugh>, what a definition for an usher. What a definition for those who serve in our outreaches outside of the church for those who clean the church. Why? Cause we’re in this together.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (36:59):
Amen. Amen. Well, Dr. Buddy Bell, thank you so much for being on the Evangelism Podcast. Ah-Huh. I love your ministry and just love your heart for helping pastors and helping build up the helps ministry in the church. God bless you.
Buddy Bell (37:14):
Amen.
Evangelism Podcast Host (37:15):
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Evangelism Coach Daniel King (38:18):
Thanks so much for listening today. I am excited about telling people about Jesus, and I want to invite you to be a part of helping us to rescue people from Hell and take them with us to heaven. There’s two things you can do to help. First of all, can you go find the Evangelism podcast on Apple iTunes and leave us a positive review By giving a review, you will help other people find these valuable resources about sharing our faith. And second, would you become a financial partner with King Ministries? Every single dollar that people give us enables us to lead at least one person to Jesus. And so that means for only $1, you can help start a party in heaven. And so today I want to invite you to become a monthly partner. You can start out for just a dollar, but if God puts it on your heart to do more, of course you can do more. But please go to king ministries.com and become a monthly partner with us today to help us to lead more people to Jesus. Thank you so much, and God bless you.
Evangelism Podcast Host (39:39):
For more information about how to share your faith or to financially support our worldwide evangelistic outreaches, visit king ministries.com. Again, that’s king ministries.com.
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Paul Fraser | Multiplying Churches in Canada
Paul Fraser is in charge of Championing, Training, and Resourcing Disciple-Makers for the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada (PAOC). He leads the Multiply Network which mentors and trains church planters across Canada. Their goal is that every Canadian will have an access point to the gospel. Today we talk about what God is doing in the nation of Canada!
Questions:
How are you helping churches to multiply?
What church growth strategies are working in Canada right now?
What trends does the PAOC see happening right now in your network of churches?
What do see are the challenges and opportunities for reaching people for Jesus in the Canadian context?
Learn More About the Multiply Network: https://paocmultiply.com/
Learn more about the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada: https://paoc.org/
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
Paul Frazier is in charge of championing training and resourcing disciple makers for the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada (PAOC). He leads the Multiply Network, which mentors and trains church planters across Canada. Their goal is that every Canadian will have an access point to the gospel. Today we talk about what God is doing in the nation of Canada.
Evangelism Podcast Host (00:41):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast with Dr. Daniel King, where Daniel interviews full-time evangelists, pastors, missionaries, and normal everyday Christians to discover how they share their faith, their powerful testimonies, and amazing stories that will inspire you to reach people with the good news. And now here’s your host, missionary, and evangelist Daniel King.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:05):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King and I’m excited about telling people about Jesus Today. I have a very special guest with me, Paul Frazier. Thank you so much for joining me on the Evangelism Podcast.
Paul Fraser (01:19):
Hey, thanks for having me.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:21):
All right, well let’s start at the beginning. Can you tell me a little bit about yourself and what you do?
Paul Fraser (01:29):
Yeah, so been in ministry now 25 years. Went to Bible college right outta high school and got married early. Went right into ministry, pastor in a local church, worked at a Christian school for a bit as a campus pastor. Ended up working at a regional district office as the district youth director and eventually kind of not aged out, but then kind of moved on to running our church, planting for our district, among other things. And now I work at the P A U C national Office as the National Church Multiplication Coordinator, which is the sister organization to Assemblies of God, us, and get an opportunity to work with some of the best leaders pioneering, entrepreneurial coming from all over the world to help us reach people in Canada through church planting. So it’s, it’s a great job. Love doing it. Lots of travel, get to meet some great people. So just really enjoying this season of ministry.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (02:30):
Yeah, the Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada, the P A O C is just a great organization. About how many churches are in the P O P O A C right now?
Paul Fraser (02:42):
Yeah, so we would, we would have about somewhere around 1100 or maybe, you know, 10 80 to 1100, somewhere in there of self-governing churches at probably another 150, 130, somewhere in there. We’re, we’re somewhere around 1200 altogether with satellite campuses, self-governing churches, and right across Canada. And we have eight districts. And so, yeah, it’s really, it’s, we’ve had a great, we, we just turned a hundred years old in 2019 and you know, had tremendous growth for the last 20 years or so. Just been plateauing, incrementally growing. So within the last 10 years we’ve had a really big push on church planting and just seeing some really fun, great results from that.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (03:33):
And so you’re leading the multiply network and I really like what it says on your website that your goal is that every Canadian would have a, an access point to the gospel. And so talk to me a little bit about kinda what God is doing in Canada, what opportunities you see, and then what challenges the church in Canada is facing right now.
Paul Fraser (03:59):
Yeah, great, great questions and thanks for referencing that cuz that is, that is our big tagline. If, if you don’t have a burden for the lost, you shouldn’t be planting a church. Like we’re not just looking to have more services for church people. There has to be a real sense of Yeah, like your church, your people, your social media, your everything could be an access point to the gospel for people to find Jesus, to have that life transforming love affect their life. And we’re in a interesting I don’t know where you’re listening from in the world today, cause I know these podcasts, the world just made is so much smaller. But in Canada, we, you know, we’ve lived in a post kind of Christian age for you know, I don’t know, maybe 20, 30 years. It depends who you, depends who you ask.
(04:51):
And so it’s great because on the one hand, people don’t have a lot of history of like, well, you know, I got hurt by church cuz I, you know, I did this and that. But it’s like, there’s a real sense of like curiosity. You know, there was a time in Canada probably just like the US where 90% of Canadians went to church. Of course that was the early 19 hundreds and everyone went to church on Sunday. It was kind of cultural and everyone did that. And now, you know, right around that 10% or a little less in Canada. So we really see a need for fresh expressions, new ways to reach people far from God and and to work with younger leaders who have a different call maybe than what I had and what my parents had and are like, are being creative and, and getting excited about trying new things and experimenting.
(05:42):
And so I’m really grateful that I get to be a part with them, provide maybe the banks of the river <laugh>, you know, for some of these young leaders that wanna do something like, hey, let’s, let’s, let’s do that, but let’s also have some structure. Let’s also have some of this. And so the opportunities here are, I actually think people are open to spirituality. There’s an openness to prayer, there’s an openness to hearing what you believe. And so, you know, used to be, you know, evangelism was, you know, very different. It was, you know, how I kind of described it in Canada was, you know, invite people to church. The pastor invites them to Jesus. And if we’re on the ball, we invite them into our life. And that’s, that can still work, that there’s nothing wrong with that. But I think maybe a more effective model is maybe invite them into your life.
(06:38):
You invite them to Jesus. And then church makes so much more sense. Like when I ch mean church, I mean the Sunday gathering. So I just think there’s an opportunity for people every day living on mission, you know, reading the great commission as, as you go about your day make disciples. And so there’s a lot of like yeah. So there’s a lot of opportunity out there. And I would say the obstacles are probably the same. Most places that there’s a hardness of heart scriptures tell us that the God of this world is blinded the eyes of man, and so they just can’t see. And so we, so we bump into those things. There’s an apathy at times within our church culture, perhaps that’s a bit more consumer, less about cause. And so, you know, I get concerned about that. I get concerned about when people think all I need to do to be a Christian is attend church regularly, give and volunteer, and then I’m fulfilling, you know, my role. And I just think, no, Jesus, Jesus is also concerned about some other things about you living on mission every day, 24 7. He’s Lord all the time. So I think we bump into the same obstacles. I mean, we could talk culturally even from this, even though Canada and the US are right next to each other, there’s some significant change, you know, differences in thinking there. Yeah.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (07:59):
What are, what,
Paul Fraser (08:00):
What do you say?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (08:00):
But I would say see are some of the differences between the United States and Canada as far as church culture and, and, and reaching out to people. I, I’m, I’m very interested in this because I, I’ve actually been praying a lot for Canada. My wife is Canadian. She grew up in Morville, small town right outside of the Edmonton area.
Paul Fraser (08:23):
I know where that is.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (08:23):
And yeah so I met her in the middle of Africa. She was a missionary girl sent out from Canada. And so God brought us together. And since I’m married to a Canadian now our ministry is is an official charity in Canada, king Ministries Canada. And, and so every year we go up to visit her family up in Morville. And I, I usually preach at different churches in, in different parts of Alberta and in other parts of Canada. So I’ve really been praying for Canada. I’ve been praying for revival to come to Canada. But as an American, you know, it’s, it’s easy to be perceived as being too pushy. I think Americans tend to be more pushy than Canadians and Canadians. They don’t like that. And so what are, what do you see are some of the differences between America and in Canada?
Paul Fraser (09:16):
Yeah, like it, we have a big, like a big value on individuality, you know, so we would, and I don’t know if this is true anymore, but when I grew up, you know, going to high school, it was kind of like Canada was this multicultural individualistic, you can, you can be whatever you need to be, however you need to be. But in the US it was, and so we called that, you know, the multiculturalism of Canada. And then a bit of a, and of course in the US this has changed significantly since I’ve been to high school. But just kind of that melty pot where it’s like, no, if you moved to the US you’re American. But in Canada you would be like, you know, African Canadian or you know, you’re from, you’re, you’re, you’re from Spain, but you’re also Canadian. But so there’s, there’s a sense of individuality.
(10:06):
So we get offended easy. So that’s why we get, sometimes when people get, we perceive as pushy, it’s like, whoa, hey, can’t we all just get along here? And it’s like, so I find the directness of like, at least in churches being d it’s easier to be direct. I find it’s easier to have conversations with people in the us I think it’s like, honestly, when I travel, I was down for conferences twice this year already. And just sitting down at tables talking with people, it’s just like, wow. Like, they’re just so easy. And because we’re individualistic, we feel like we don’t wanna talk to people about our personal lives or faith and we don’t wanna offend. That’s like, like the cardinal sin of being. And so if you offend, you always say, you know, I’m sorry there’s a, you know, we always get Canadians like just, they’re so apologetic because we’re always offended it. So I think we, I’m
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:00):
Sorry for being sorry so much <laugh>. I’m sorry for being so
Paul Fraser (11:03):
Yeah, like, I’m sorry for being sorry. And I’m sorry that it offended you and all of those things. And, but when it comes to church planting we’re one-tenth the size of the US And so when sometimes the books get written from a US perspective saying, oh, your launch team needs to be this many people and you should have this many people on Sunday. And you know, this is how fast. And you hear the stories of like, yeah, we started in our garage and we grew to 500, you know, in six months. And those stories happen because the population density is, is different. There I think there’s a bit more openness maybe to, to coming to a Sunday gathering where there’d be less in Canada. And we just find like a 500 person church in Canada is like bordering on large. Like if you’re 500 person, you’re so times 10, that’s a 5,000 person church Yeah.
(11:55):
In the us. And so I think we always feel a little like, like, you know, just we’re the little brother for sure in that. And so we kind of resist some of the, you know, US strategies for church planning cuz they just don’t jive the same. So I think we grow a little bit more organically in our thinking and we’re less like big box store structure. I think we’re a little bit more agile, we’re able to explore things a little bit different. Of course those are huge generalizations and, but that would just be some of my takes as I go to church planning conferences and leadership and different things like that as it relates to church world. But, and send some of the cultural differences there as well.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (12:37):
Yeah. So in the Canadian context, what are you doing to help churches to multiply and grow?
Paul Fraser (12:49):
Yeah, so obviously sharing the vision of church multiplication the opportunity for us to reach people far from God, I, I try to remind a church planter as they’re like trying to figure out banking and trying to figure out structures and finances and all these things and teams. And I try to remind them like, Hey, picture that first person that gets saved on a Sunday. Or, you know, you know, someone says from your, your core team, they got like picture that. And so keeping the vision of why we’re doing it is really important when a church planter or somebody, and again, I think church planting is one of the most effective ways in North America to reach people far from God. I think there’s a lot of status that would support that. Even the eyeball test for me as I go around different churches and compare size of church and look at their stats year over year to an existing church that there are more salvations that happen in a church plant.
(13:50):
But, you know, keeping the vision in front of them, keeping it like, this is why we’re doing it. We’re, we’re not. Just like, one of the things that I think maybe church planting 20 years ago was built more around, we’re planting a service, not a church. Like let’s just plant a gathering. And then, because that was a really effective way to reach people. And it was. But I think less and less certainly post covid, we’re seeing like regular attendance to a church now be 2.2 times a month. And we’re seeing boomers not come back to church. And, and gen Xers specifically are two groups that just are not, they’re not coming back millennials with young families and Gen Xers or sorry, gen Z. They seem to be, you know, finding their way back to, you know, houses of worship in, in, in churches.
(14:38):
But yeah, man, I, I think, I think just keeping the vision in front of them, like this is why we do it. And this is, and, and if you went on a website too, I think somewhere else we try to exist to take the guesswork out of it to help churches because they don’t have time to read all the books, they don’t have time to do all the training, they don’t have time to do all the steps that are needed to help get a new disciple making community going. So we try to come alongside them and support them. We’re, we want to come alongside their vision, their idea, but we, but obviously we wanna share like, yeah, we, we need to be like planting churches cuz we’re closing churches not to the, and at least in our POC tribe we’re slightly outpacing our closures with new starts and that’s just not, we’re not gonna reach Canada incrementally. It’s gotta be this multiplication, exponential thing. And so sharing the vision of like, you can start a church, you can do it, maybe it’s micro church, maybe it’s a campus, maybe, you know, it’s an organic grow where you look at a town next to you and you start an alpha and you know, everybody can kind of do something. Everyone can be an access point to the gospel. And so we just try to share that vision and get them and equip them and train them as best we can.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (15:57):
Now I, I really like the fact that you are mentoring in coaching church planners. So kind of talk me through that process. If you have a, a young man of God who comes to you and says, I it’s really been on my heart to, to start a church, I really feel a call to, to be a ministry, to be a pastor. How would you encourage him to, to plan a church and then walk him through the process? How, how long does that process take and and what are some of the things that you’re telling him?
Paul Fraser (16:29):
Yeah, so we, we have you know, church planters who kind of jump into our pipeline either at the district level or at a national level. And one of the things that, there is a book some years ago written by, I’m just trying to look for it on my shelf to get their, I think it’s called The Honest Guide to Church Planting by Tom Bernardo. And I get them to read that book and if they still want to plant churches, like after reading that book, then it’s like, okay, that’s like a good first step and literal, legit, that’s what I’ve done. I’m like, please read this book because it’s honest. Like, hey, the people you start with won’t be the people there in three years. You know, and you know, this is gonna happen, this is gonna happen. People say they’re with you and then won’t.
(17:11):
And then new people will come with new ideas and try to shift the vision and you know, all those things. And so if you read that, that’s great. But so we try to get them like, ah, tried to get them to realistically look at not an ideal world like dream world, that this is what, you know, I hear all the church planting stories and everything’s gonna be like this. Like it’s actually hard work, it’s a grind. Making disciples isn’t easy reaching people far from God and getting into that culture. So I try to get, you know, try to figure out, okay, how serious are you about it? Have you read this book? What do you think? So we talk about that. But as we go through the coaching there, there’s also an assessment that needs to happen. It’s not just good enough that you’re called, there’s a certain skillset set that you’re gonna need for a certain, you know, whatever model of church planting.
(17:59):
So we walk them through pre-assessment and then we walk them through a formal assessment after that. That would then kind of kick in some coaching. It would kick in some training. And you know, to do most launch model churches, you’re looking at about nine to 12 months. Cuz there’s fundraising that needs to happen. There’s training, team development, finding space leasing, all those things. So I try to you know, try to get them thinking like, if you want to start in September, you’re going to need, you know, really to be hitting it pretty hard in January. Now some guys start a year out and I think if you get your team meeting too early, you’ll lose a bit of steam when you actually need it in launch season. So there’s this like balance of like, yes, I want to get the team on board, but I don’t wanna start too early.
(18:55):
Cuz our launch is still nine months away. So yeah. But it’s usually about nine months in and monthly coaching I’m available. Our district lead teams or multiply network lead team is available to answer questions. And so what makes our movement a little interesting is it’s not standardized. Every district has a different process. So I try to learn all the processes and then just come alongside them. We’re working on talking about standardizing some things, but you know, we’re literally, the multi-network is here to serve them. And so whatever we can do to help them, we do. But yeah, I actually am a certified life coach and so this is just really up my alley and I love doing it and just really helping, helping them get from where they are today to where they want to be. That’s just a real big dream of mine.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (19:47):
Yeah, coaching is so valuable. You can either learn from your mistakes or you can learn from someone else’s mistakes. And so a coach can help you avoid some of the, the big mistakes that that might be made. What are some of the, the mistakes that church planners sometimes make that you can help them to avoid?
Paul Fraser (20:06):
Yeah, so I think, I think starting to early with a team, that that is definitely one leaving fundraising too late is another thing where you don’t say, yeah, you know, I’m working on building the team. It’s like, have you talked to any donors yet? Have you talked to your district? Have you talked to churches that might, oh no, yeah, I’m gonna get to that. And you know, we try to build in to their training, like have one conversation a week, nine months out. Because sometimes it takes two or three or four or five meetings before a donor feels comfortable. Like, oh, this is actually gonna go. And one of the important things that we try to drill in is like, hey, donor confidence is critically important. So have good reporting, have good, all of that. I would say what’s a, what’s another mistake that that planters, oh, they try to do too much on their own and they don’t rely enough on team.
(21:07):
So you wanna make sure you have a team, develop your team, spend time with them take time to think through your discipleship pathway. That’s huge. Like what is it? And if I walked into your church day one, could your core team tell me the next step? Like what’s the next step in discipleship? Are they aware of your discipleship pathway? Cause I ask pastors all the time, Hey, do you guys have a discipleship pathway? Yes we do. Great. Does anyone know it? Like, is it functioning? Is it clear? Do, does your board know it? Does your your team know it does, you know, so we don’t wanna be planting churches that don’t have disciple making culture. So I drill down like, you tell me someone walking off the street who’s never heard the name of Jesus before and get them to be a leader in your church.
(22:02):
What’s the process? And that’s, that’s the kind of thinking I really, really want to have in our new churches that we start, is that disciple making culture. Cause I think we overlook it and think, well, discipleship will just kind of accidentally happen. No, no. What’s the intentional process, steps training that you need to build this culture in your church? That’s critically important. And yeah, and it’s, and just, I think people get excited about having space and thinking that it’s gonna be theirs forever. And the reality is you’ll move probably several times before you’ll find a more permanent space. And, and you just gotta be okay with the, you gotta be okay with flexibility. We try to drill that in, don’t be too rigid, don’t try to get too worked up about how things aren’t moving. So there’s a, I don’t know, just off the top of my head, those are some of the things that I think through and try to help planters think through.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (23:02):
What would an ideal discipleship process look like? I, I think that’s a great question. If you have someone coming off the street who doesn’t know Jesus and, and you wanna bring them through their relationship and eventually become a leader in the church, what are some discipleship processes that you’ve seen that, that you really think other churches should, should emulate?
Paul Fraser (23:25):
Yeah, so this is probably the most, probably the most simple one that I, that I, I’ve created with our, our training. It was, it comes from actually Dr. Howard Hendricks years ago, and I can’t remember where, if I was at a conference or I heard it on a tape. Remember when we used to have tapes, you could have a tape.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (23:42):
That was a long time ago.
Paul Fraser (23:44):
That was a long time. Like back
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (23:46):
When Jesus walked on the earth. Yeah,
Paul Fraser (23:48):
<Laugh>. Yeah. So I think he captured something that was really, really important. He talked about characteristics of a disciple. So I’m not, I don’t care how this gets done, I don’t care where it gets done. I just want to ensure that that person walking off the street has these three things that are being built into them. The characteristics of a disciple, again, from Dr. Howard Hendricks, first one, are you a learner? So you need someone to ensure what that this new person is. What are they learning? Second thing, who are they following? So do they have, and again, now today with content being so accessible, you actually have to get into people’s lives. Like who are you listening to? Like who are you, what podcast? Like, but to have someone just walking with them again, dec decide you can’t disciple from a distance very well.
(24:40):
You’ve gotta be, there’s a proximity piece. So what am I learning? Who am I following? And then there needs to be evaluation of what’s being reproduced in my life. And I think we need to spend a little bit more time on that thing, making sure that the people we’re discipling are producing the fruit of the spirit. So we actually go through it with them. How’s your love level, joy, peace, patience, kindness. Because when you’re connected to Christ, you bear this, you don’t have to work hard. So this is a, this is a telltale sign that you are connected to Jesus if this fruit is growing in your life. So you ask questions like, how’s your patience level with your kids? Not great. Okay, how do we fix that connection to Jesus? Great. how’s your, you know, how’s your self-control not great? Okay, great.
(25:32):
How do we fix that connection to Jesus? And so we can, we can use those characteristics as a way, and again, that can have through small groups one-on-one. I think Sunday mornings can play a huge part in that on the teaching and inspiration, that type of thing. And then at some point they turn from learner follower, reproducer to a teacher leader and multiplier. So when you, when you’re, when you feel like you, what am I learning? Who am I following? What’s being reproduced in my life? Then, then we ask you to be a teacher. What are you teaching? How are you leading and what are you multiplying in others? So there’s that, there’s that you start as the student, but at some point the discipleship process should lead you to you know, teacher leader and then multiplier. So I try to, I say I don’t care how that shows up, but are those characteristics being built into the culture of your church? And if they are, then there’s a good chance that a discipleship culture is being developed, but it does take time.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (26:42):
Do you find that you need different strategies for different parts of Canada? Like when you go to Alberta, Vancouver, there’s some really big churches, some really amazing churches, then you go to like Quebec and it’s under 2% Christian. I mean, it’s really like a mission field. Yeah. Over there are are, are you developing different strategies for different parts of Canada?
Paul Fraser (27:05):
Yeah, I think we need to, certainly you make a a great point about Quebec being francophone less than it’s, I think it’s less than 1% evangelical. So when you think about like our, our Western hemisphere, it’s one of the darkest places like void of evangelical gospel witness it, it’s Quebec and there’s just a different culture and mindset there. So yeah, I think there has to be a different strategy for our francophone family and and province. I think there’s a different strategy that’s needed for suburban, urban, and rural. So it’s not just one cookie cutter, here’s how it works. And all of those mean something different. So an urban center in Saskatchewan, for example, is I think Saskatoon is maybe 400,000 people that would be urban for Saskatchewan. Okay. What’s urban in Toronto is, you know, 11 million people in the GTA area.
(28:16):
So there is a huge difference when we talk urban from district to district, rural, either rural, like in Ontario, they think like a rural town is like 15 or 20,000, but rural in Alberta or Manitoba or Saskatchewan might be 150 people. So there, you’re right, we have to contextualize this for each province. And then as you break it down for each part of the province, like Northwest Territories for example, like up there, like Candace’s got this massive land mass, and, but I think there’s like, ah, don’t quote me on it, maybe 60,000 people in all of Northwest territories. Like it’s just really spread out in time. So you need a different church planting strategy and mission strategy for that too. So the diversity, the different kind of Canada and Maritimers are different than West Coast and I mean, it would be the same in the US wouldn’t it?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (29:19):
Yeah. And the East coast is very different than Oklahoma where I live. It, it’s very much more of a, a mission field and it takes a whole different thick skin to go and witness all the heathens that live over there that maybe don’t have a, a tradition of, of knowing God. I mean, here in Oklahoma even people that go to church, you know, they, they grew up in church at least. So they know something about God, right?
Paul Fraser (29:45):
There’s a Christian memory. Yeah, there’s a Christian memory, right? Yeah,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (29:48):
Yeah. Another unique opportunity I think you have in Canada is there are so many people coming to Canada from many different parts of the world. Yes. Where Canada, yes, for many years has sent missionaries out all over the world. But now God is really bringing the mission field to you, and especially in Edmonton. I mean, you’ve got people of every different culture and, and language and different foods that you can eat. And so that’s a, a unique opportunity for the church to, to reach out cross culturally and, and cross language groups. And God is, is bringing you and I people that need Jesus
Paul Fraser (30:28):
And, and, and people who know Jesus. That’s the other thing. Like we, some of our best church planters that we’ve had in the last five years moved here in the last five years. Like they’ve, they’ve planted multiple churches or it, it, so you know that Luke 10, two Lord, you know, send workers, send workers into your harvest fields. And we are reaping the, the efforts, the, the missional heart of missionaries going overseas to you name the country. And, and God has used, you know, those decades of faithful ministry to raise up people who have now come back to Canada, excuse me, to help us reach people far from God. So yeah. So not only are there like, I think 300 or 400,000 people are immigrating to Canada from the wor around the world every single year. So that is a huge opportunity. But many of them are coming already faith-filled believers, spirit empowered believers, and come here and go, how do we help you reach Canada?
(31:37):
We’re gonna help you reach those from Afghanistan who are being brought here. We’re gonna help you reach and, and you know, those from Pakistans or India. India and, and, and from Africa and you just Europe and you just go through the list and you just are so thankful that God cares enough about Canada, that he’s raising up people from all over the world to come here. We’re so honored. And I’ll be honest with you, our biggest growing edge of church planting is our cultural language group pastors. And they, they bring this apostolic gifting and heart that is such a blessing to us. If we had more time, I could tell you stories of what God has done through them and how they’re impacting their country still through online ministry. So they’re here in Canada, planting church is seeing fruitful ministry and are still leading at home, seeing great things getting up in the middle of the night to preach at their church Sunday morning. Amazing. Like it’s just the, these, these wonderful leaders, men and women are gifts to us and we thank God for them.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (32:41):
That’s awesome. Well, brother Paul, thank you so much for being a guest on the Evangelism Podcast. Let’s finish up today by praying for the Nation of Canada. You know, if you’re listening, you wanna know more about the, the p ooc and the Multiply network, you can go to www.paocmultiply.com and find out more information. But let, let’s just finish up by, by praying for God to pour out his spirit upon the nation of Canada and from sea to shining sea. I, I see God pouring out the spirit upon all of Canada.
Paul Fraser (33:20):
Come on.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (33:21):
Go ahead. And so
Paul Fraser (33:22):
You want me to pray? Yeah, go for it. Yeah. So, God, God, thank you for this podcast. Thank you for Pastor Daniel who just is willing to find and connect and bring great voices together to hopefully share and inspire, teach and learn about what you are doing today and what you wanna do in the future. And so I thank you for this podcast, bless it and bless him as he continues to travel all over. And just, just preach your word and see so many lives transformed by the moving of your spirit. But we do think of Canada today from as was mentioned, C to C to C. We have three of them that are surrounding Canada. And I pray God for a heart that would turn back to you. There are wells of, of strong Christian foundation. There are there’s a history that God, this was a Christian nation at one point.
(34:22):
And so wherever people are whatever they’re listening, however they’re listening to this right now and whenever they’re listening to it, that there was, there would be an agreement for you to do something special in Canada. God, I believe that if Canada wins, the world is gonna win. A Canada that is sending a Canada that has got kingdom culture is going to help impact the world. And God, I thank you for what you’ve done in the last a hundred years in poc. But I pray our former years, God, that that our future years would be better than our former years. And we had great years, but we’re believing that there’s even better days ahead. So God, we together in agreement, pray for all those in Canada. Over 30 million people who don’t know you as Lord and Savior, we pray God, that even in this next decade, we would see a mighty move of your spirit sweep across this nation. And we thank you for Canada and we thank you that it’s got a great place in the world to be an impact for you. And we ask all this in your name. Amen.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (35:32):
Amen. Well, thank you for being on the Evangelism podcast.
Paul Fraser (35:37):
Thanks so much for having me.
Evangelism Podcast Host (35:39):
Are you called by God to be an evangelist? Do you wanna lead millions of people to Jesus? Do you desire to be trained in the practical side of building a ministry? Then check out the Daniel King’s School of Evangelism. Learn how to be an effective evangelist from Dr. Daniel King’s 20 plus years of experience. Daniel King has done crusades all over the world in over 70 nations and has seen over 2 million people give their lives to Jesus. But it wasn’t easy. There was no crusade school. So Daniel traveled the world learning from and observing top evangelists, noticing how they successfully won souls for Christ. Now he wants to share decades of knowledge and experience with you. Topics of the Daniel King School of Evangelism include what is an evangelist, how to be a master soul winner, how to give an ultra call, how to organize a crusade, how to raise money for your ministry, and much more. If you wanna be an evangelist, but don’t know where to start, the Daniel King School of Evangelism is for you. Enroll today in the School of Evangelism by going to Daniel King ministries.com/evangelism.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (36:40):
Thanks so much for listening today. I am excited about telling people about Jesus, and I want to invite you to be a part of helping us to rescue people from Hell and take them with us to heaven. There’s two things you can do to help. First of all, can you go find the Evangelism podcast on Apple iTunes and leave us a positive review by giving a review. You will help other people find these valuable resources about sharing our faith. And second, would you become a financial partner with King Ministries? Every single dollar that people give us enables us to lead at least one person to Jesus. And so that means for only $1, you can help start a party in heaven. And so today I want to invite you to become a monthly partner. You can start out for just a dollar, but if God puts it on your heart to do more, of course you can do more. But please go to king ministries.com and become a monthly partner with us today to help us to lead more people to Jesus. Thank you so much, and God bless you.
Evangelism Podcast Host (38:01):
For more information about how to share your faith or to financially support our worldwide evangelistic outreaches, visit king ministries.com. Again, that’s king ministries.com.
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Waldy Bersche | Saving the Lost
Waldy Berche is my friend and he recently joined me for a crusade in Kemba, Ethiopia. Today on The Evangelism Podcast he tells about what God did in local market places and he shares what he learned from me when I was teaching at the Christ for All Nations Evangelism Bootcamp.
Learn more about Waldy Bersche: https://savingthelost.com/
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King, and I’m excited about telling people about Jesus. Today, I have a very special guest with me, Waldy Bersche from Germany,
Waldy Bersche (00:11):
Yes. So my name is Waldy Bersche. Yes. I’m from Germany.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:14):
Well, we are in the nation of Ethiopia. We have just completed doing a great gospel crusade in Kemba, Ethiopia. And you came along with me as a co evangelist. Yes. And we saw God do some amazing things. What really stood out to you this week?
Waldy Bersche (00:34):
So for me, we had a lot of healings, and this really stood out for me. So we prayed for people and they were healed right in front of our eyes. People who were blind before, people who were deaf in their ears. And it’s really great to see how God is healing people on the spot sometimes. You see how healing is working in the progress, but when Jesus heals on the spot, that so it’s great
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:56):
Miracle. What were some of the notable healings that you saw?
Waldy Bersche (00:59):
We had a lady, she was, she had pain in her body for over 30 years, and this really impacted me because she, she was suffering for 30 years and then Jesus heal her in the church. We preached in different churches and I thought about man suffering for 30 years. That’s a long time, but now Jesus was really gracious and
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:21):
Yeah. Now you actually came early Yes. To the crusade, and you spent some time helping the publicity team to tell everyone Yes. About what was happening. And you went into some marketplaces. Tell me what happened.
Waldy Bersche (01:35):
So it was really unexpected for me because I thought the markets would be small, but we came there and markets, we had over 3000 people. I’m a white person, so I have a little bit of sunburn, but there, because of my white skin, it was really a great advantage. So the the children came to us as soon as we opened the door of the truck, and it was a great attraction. So we didn’t have to pay money for advertisement just to have white skin. It was, was a great advantage. And we preached there and yeah, it was actually crusades, I mean, three, 4,000 people on a marketplace. It was awesome. So I stood in on top of the truck. I was preaching with a microphone. I was totally surrounded by a big crowd, and I had to tour myself all the time and to see everyone. But yeah, Jesus did the same miracles. He was the same on the markets as on the big crusade fields.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (02:30):
When I first met you, it was at an ACE conference, the Association of Campaign evangelists, and we were in Sweden together, and we started to talk, and you asked me where I was going and I said next week I go to Egypt, and you decided to jump in and say, can I go with you? And so the very next day we jumped on a plane together, we went to Alexandria Egypt, where we had a, a very nice event there. And lots of people from Sudan got saved. Yes, yes, that’s true in Alexandria. And then you have this great desire to be an evangelist. Yes. And so you went to the Christ for All Nations Evangelism Bootcamp. Yeah. and I was one of the instructors. Yeah. And then since then, you’ve gone full-time into evangelism, just giving yourself for Jesus Christ. What were some of the things that you learned in the Evangelism Bootcamp that now are helping you to tell people about Jesus?
Waldy Bersche (03:29):
So, I learned a lot of things, especially from you. I really, what do I like about you is that you write books. So I have, you’ve written a lot of books, and my goal is to write also a couple of books. So when we were together in, in Egypt, I always saw you writing on the laptop. And this really impacted me. I said, okay, if Daniel writes, I mean, then I have to write. Paul wrote also and his letters we read after 2000 years. And you said, okay if I’m going to die, my books will still preach the gospel. And that’s what I like. So this is one thing. And also the boldness just to Yeah. Stand on a crusade field just to stay on a platform and preach in front of 30 thou or 40,000 people. It’s totally different.
(04:11):
Not everyone can do this, but you made it and thought, okay I would like to learn from Daniel. I would like to learn from the best. And what, what I also really like is you told me that you read a book when you were 15 years, how to become a millionaire. And so you said, okay, I don’t want to become a dollar millionaire, but a soul millionaire. And this stuck in my head. I said, okay, Daniel brought 1 million people to Jesus. What are my goals in life? Do I want to get rich? Do I want to be famous? But I also want to lead 1 million people to Jesus. That’s my goal. So,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (04:45):
Amen. I’m
Waldy Bersche (04:46):
Really up to you
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (04:47):
And agree with you that you will become a soul millionaire in the name of Jesus. And you’re already well on your way. You’ve been ministering with Christ for all nations. Yes. You were part of de capitalist previously in Yes. Just now you’re going to go to Zambia. Yeah. And you’re going to be helping with one of the, the Christ for all nations de capitalist crusades. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> you’re gonna be helping to organize it Yeah. And set it up. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and, and so you’re just giving everything you have for Jesus. And you’ve also launched your ministry. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, what’s the name of your ministry?
Waldy Bersche (05:19):
So my ministry is called Saving the Lost.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (05:21):
Saving the Lost. And if someone wants to find out about your ministry or donate to help you with all the different Yeah. Crusades and, and outreaches that you’re doing. Yeah. how can they do that?
Waldy Bersche (05:31):
Yeah. So you can just go to www saving the lost.com. Also, I just started the YouTube channel. There’s some videos also. I have Telegram also. I’m on Instagram. So I’m just Google me and you will find
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (05:43):
Me. Now let’s talk about how you got started. You had this desire from God to be an evangelist. Yes. But you didn’t really know what to do or how to do it. Yeah. So how did you start learning to be an evangelist?
Waldy Bersche (05:55):
So I always when I was young, a lot of missionaries came into my church. And this really left a great impression on me. So I, I read the magazines from the missionaries and I said, one day, I want to become a missionary. So I knew cfa, I knew Billy Graham, but I was so shy that, okay, I cannot contacted Billy Graham Ministries or Christ Fall Nation. Who am I? I’m just a small fish. So then I, on Google, I found by accident another crusade evangelist. He was from Sweden. And I ask him, may
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (06:27):
I come? My friend Marcus Blue,
Waldy Bersche (06:28):
Right. And I ask him, may I come along on one of your trips? So invited me to India, and there is somewhere in the Himalayas on, on, in a pastor’s conference. I saw how God opened up a deaf ear and I thought, oh, Jesus is still healing today, like 2000 years ago. And then we went to the south of India and I saw a crusade. And Marcos gave me the opportunity to start the crusade where he gave me five minutes as an opener. And I preach my heart out. And then when I took the microphone, I realized I want to be a crusade evangelist and discontinued. And I went to Pakistan, other countries as well.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (07:07):
You caught the missions bug. Yes. And, and now you continue in it. And I believe that God will give you Yeah. The million souls that you’re asking for. And even beyond you will be a, a soul millionaire in Jesus name. Thank you so much. Well, Valdi, we are very honored that you came and partnered with us for this great gospel crusade in Kemba, Ethiopia. And I really hope we can do something more together once again very soon. So thank you and God bless you.
Waldy Bersche (07:34):
Thank you so much, Daniel. It’s an honor.
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Lako Bedasso | What is God Doing in Ethiopia?
Lako Bedasso is the president of Ethiopia Full Gospel Church. He says his denomination has ten million people and 3,500 different churches. Today, he talks about the great harvest and the great challenges that are facing the Ethiopian church.
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King, and I’m very excited about telling people about Jesus. Today I have a very special guest with me, pastor Laco Beso. Yes. He is one of the key leaders here in the nation of Ethiopia. Tell me a little bit about your denomination. You’re the president, what is God doing here in Ethiopia and what is God doing through the denomination?
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Yeah. it is a, this day is a time of harvest and the time of challenge for us nowadays. When I say the time of harvest, many people are coming to Jesus. A Ethiopian focus will believers church. I am a president for Ethiopian focus gospel will believers church. We have 10 million believers in 3,527 local churches that is organized in for regions.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:04):
What a blessing. God is moving in such great ways here in Ethiopia.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Yeah. The God is doing great work and, and great thing is happening now. There is one area, there is a, the area is controlled by rebellions before five man for three years it was suffering in that area. Now the pieces come, the intimidator who bring that peace is our pastor from that ethnic group. So among the Liberian ethnic group, in one day I baptize 107 believers. Wow. It is three weeks ago what is happening. So God is moving in our country and touching all ethnic group. Beside that, there is a challenge also, and nowadays there is 52 local church worshiping build is destroyed. It’s need to, for us to re reconstruct that one. And we are looking the people for <inaudible>.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (02:24):
And so there is great persecution Yes. In some areas of Ethiopia. Yes. Yes. And they’ve destroyed over 50 churches. Yes. And now.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
Yes.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (02:33):
And now you’re looking for help to come and, and rebuild.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Yes. Yeah. We are, we are praying to God to send someone to support and stand with us. And in 22 places it is very urgent. The people are coming up in the worshiping under some trees and under very small shade. So it, it’s in need. Great. Now, additionally, we need CRO in the, the people are very, very in need to come to Jesus. The gospel is very important to healing our country, to heal our people. So we, we like to invite you to come again and to preach in my country.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (03:21):
Oh, thank you. I’ve been coming to Ethiopia ever since 2008. So 15 years now. The, this crusade we just did in Kemba is the 10th crusade that we have done here. And I have fallen in love with the people of Ethiopia. You know the United States is not mentioned in the Bible. Canada is not mentioned in the Bible, but Ethiopia is mentioned so many times in the Bible. And God has such a special plan for this nation and for the people. And I’m just so excited to see the, the amazing work that God is doing through your ministry. You and I actually met in South Korea. Yes. We were at the, the conference for the World Pentecostal Fellowship. Yes. And we were sitting on the bus together and you, you told me, you said, Daniel,
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Please,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (04:13):
You must come to Ethiopia, do a crusade, come and do a pastor’s conference. And so if, if I was to come, what, in what ways could I help your church? What, what, what could I do to be a blessing to you?
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah. And as you told me that, say that we met in, in South Korea conference. I am ambassador of Ethiopian at the, for the Pentecostal World Fellowship. Here I, this, this one
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (04:47):
It’s beautiful pin. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
So when you come to Ethiopia, number one, you share the grace of God that given to you to share for Roman and to pray for empowering of the ministers and the pastors. And number two, we invite the peoples from different part of the country and other Ethiopia, you know, the economic situation. Maybe you support, you support some of Fundis by, by by just having the room eating and all transportation for some people who do not have capacity to come this area in such way, if you support us, we need, moreover, we need your grace that God gave you.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (05:46):
Oh, thank you. Well, I would be very honored to come and we must make plans because I believe that, that God will do something very great. If you’re listening to this, I have lots of missionaries and evangelists that listen, please come to Ethiopia. There is a great harvest here that people that are ready to come to Jesus. In the Book of Psalms, it says that Ethiopia shall quickly stretch out her hands towards God. And we have seen that so many times. And it’s so beautiful to see what God is doing here. Thank you, brother for being on the Evangelism podcast. Amen.
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Help Us Buy a Sound System | The Joshua Campaign in Ethiopia
Joshua Campaign has led millions of people to Jesus in the past 25 years in Ethiopia. But now they need to purchase a new sound system. Today I talk with Per Akvist about why it is so important to invest in the infrastructure of evangelism. Can you help?
To Give Towards a Sound System for Ethiopia go to: https://joshuacampaign.com/
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King, and I am excited about telling people about Jesus. Today I am in the nation of Ethiopia with my good friend, Per Akvist. Per, thank you for joining me on the Evangelism Podcast.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (00:14):
Thank you for having me.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:16):
We have just completed a wonderful crusade in the city of Kemba. Yes. We went to, we flew into Arbor Mench and then drove about three and a half hours up into the mountains. Yes, ma’am. And God did tremendous miracles,
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (00:32):
Even in the rain. It was fantastic.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:35):
And the amazing thing is, is that Joshua campaign, the organization that you lead, lead here in Ethiopia, you have been doing crusades for 25 years now. That’s correct. Across this nation. Yes. And so,
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (00:51):
Well, 15 under my leadership,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:53):
15 under your leadership before you Carl Haram. Yes. founded Joshua campaign. Yes. And Joshua campaign has literally seen millions of people come to Jesus. Now, the reason that I wanted to talk to you today is because Joshua campaign is launching a new project to prepare for the next 25 years of ministry. We think that God is working in mighty ways here in Ethiopia, and we want to be a part of it.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (01:26):
Wonderful. You’re so welcome,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:28):
<Laugh>. Thank you. Yes. And we, we’ve actually talked before about Joshua campaign on the Evangelism podcast. Yes. but today I really want to focus in and talk about this new sound system that Joshua campaign is raising funds for the sound system that you have. It was bought 25 years ago, and pieces of it have been replaced over the years
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (01:54):
And lot of repaired
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:56):
In a lot of repair. And even at this crusade, I was going and looking at some of the wires that are duct tape. They are wrapped up together. And you have a, a, a small truck and a generator that, that pull, that is pulled along with the truck, and then you have a, a platform, but really it’s come become time that all of that needs to be replaced. Tell, tell me some of the need of why.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (02:22):
As you said, the, the sound system is very well used. It’s I would say it’s good invested money. We, we have done so many crusades with this sound equipment, and of course, so much repairs as well. Today we have a good sound. But you see, you hear my voice as well. We, we, we use it with our own power as well. But the, the next step, we celebrating now 25 years, and with the 25 years anniversary, we would like to a new sound system. And we have something really good going on. And that’s an investment of a hundred thousand dollars we need to sell this truck that we have by a bigger one. The trailer is not good. Having the generator is not good having on the trailer, it’s a lot of accidents and things can happen on, on the Ethiopian roads, <laugh>, it’s very special roads here.
(03:32):
So we, we need to put the trailer on top of the I mean the generator on top of the, the, the truck. We need a larger truck in order to carry the new sound system. All in all sound stage is also, is, it’s a lot of cast irons and it’s very heavy for the boys to work with. And it’s, so it is in general, the whole, our, all of our equipment is very old and very much used. The total amount that we are calculating on now with the new truck, with preparing a new stage, the sound and all, a lot of, lot of details around we looking into a total cost of $170,000. So
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (04:28):
$170,000, you’re going to replace the platform, the sound system, and get a new truck to mount it all on. Yes. And that is a, a significant amount of money, but I was thinking about investing in the equipment that’s needed for evangelism. Now, think about a church, I was thinking about this the other day. If, if you think about a church, most of the ministry that a church does happens inside the church building. Yes. Yes. And so churches will often do a capital campaign and they will raise a lot of money in order to build a new building. And sometimes it can cost millions of dollars to build a new church building. And they ask their entire congregation to help to build the building. And, and people make commitments. And sometimes it takes a few years. They say, I will make a commitment of this amount every month for the next three years in order to help make it happen. Now, the, the reason that the ministry of a church invests in the church building is because the church building is where their ministry takes place.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (05:36):
And for members to have a comfortable place to sit in air condition and Yeah. Yeah.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (05:42):
Now for an evangelist, we don’t minister in a church building. We go out on the dusty fields. Yes. And our ministry takes place on a platform. And so I really think by investing in the infrastructure of evangelism, you can accomplish far more forgot. Sometimes evangelists go to a nation and they, they rent a sound system just from a local music group, and it can cost a significant amount of money. I mean, they can spend up to five, $6,000 per night just renting the sound system. But the benefit of owning the sound system is then you don’t have all of that cost of renting. You own it. You can go and set it up, and at the drop of a hat, you can go anywhere that God tells you to go. Anywhere that the door opens up, you can go set up the sound system in very easily. You can have a crusade.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (06:44):
It’s a big harvesting machine.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (06:47):
<Laugh>, it’s a big harvesting machine. Now the good news is that Joshua campaign has been already given a significant gift
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (06:56):
That’s good.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (06:57):
Of $100,000.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (06:58):
That is really good
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (06:59):
News, <laugh>. And it comes from the everyone fund. Yes. from Empower 21, everyone is a vision by Dr. Billy Wilson, who is the president of Oral Roberts University. Yes. And he leads Empower 21. He’s also the president of the World Pentecostal churches right now. And God gave Dr. Billy Wilson a vision to reach everyone on earth with the gospel before 2033, so that every single person would have an authentic encounter with Jesus Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit before 2033, the 2000 year anniversary of Pentecost.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (07:39):
Yes. And that vision connect so well with the Joshua campaign. Our vision is one chance for every person.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (07:48):
One chance for every person. And so for 25 years, Joshua Campaign has been working here in Ethiopia trying to give one chance for every person to hear the gospel.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (07:58):
And I would say in that context of Ethiopia, where you have seen such a great opening after the communism, we, Carl came in right there in the beginning, and I came 10 years later. And all, in all 25 years in a situation where you have the nation was almost unreached, totally unreached till today you have it out of 120 million people, you have about 20% evangelical believers. And we have been a part of that. And I can say that from our platform, and I’m trying to, to, I don’t want to be an, an evangelist that pulling numbers here and there, but literally millions of people and moderate calculating, I believe around 4 million or, I mean, it is about, about 4 million people have come to Christ from preaching on, on our platform. So I think it’s good, invested money.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:07):
So this investment of this new sound system over the next 25 years, it could potentially result in millions more people coming into the Kingdom of heaven. Absolutely. And so for my listeners today, I want to invite you to invest in this sound system in the nation of Ethiopia. Yeah. And I have lots of evangelists who listen, I hope they will invest and then maybe even come here and preach with the sound system. You
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (09:40):
Are welcome. Give us seed money and God can open up the doors.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:45):
So we need $170,000. We have already had this grant of $100,000, so that leads $70,000. And with that we need to update the platform, update the sound system by a new truck. Just in, we, we are investing in the infrastructure of evangelism because the platform is where the ministry takes place for an evangelist. Exactly. And so I want to ask you to give something to help out with this. Perhaps you could give $10,000, $20,000. The cost of the truck is gonna be about $30,000. Maybe you’re listening. A guy will put it on your heart to go ahead and invest and buy a truck for Joshua campaign. That’s great. And so we need your help. Anything that you want to give you can contact me and at king ministries.com. Give me a call and I’ll tell you how to invest. What’s your website if
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (10:43):
Joshua campaign.com. We have a paper account there. It’s easy
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (10:47):
Joshuacampaign.Com. So if you want to give at joshuacampaign.com, you can, if you have a significant gift that you wanna make sure that you wire it directly into the account, contact me or contact brother pair
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (11:01):
And we will we just open up a new account in America as well. And that information will be on the website as well.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:11):
Wonderful. Further on. So I want to ask you to please help us invest in the infrastructure of evangelism by putting money into the sound system. It makes every crusade way cheaper to do. Yes. And it makes it possible to do so much more for God. And we need to help Joshua campaign because right now the wires are held together with spit and duct tape, and they have been so faithful. Over 4 million souls have come to Jesus with the platform that they have now. And with this updated platform, I think we will be able to reach bigger crowds, more people, and the, the, the team will not have to be out there holding wires together in the middle of the lightning storm. And it’ll
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (12:00):
Be easier to work with. It’s going to be liner race, so it’s going to be easier to, for them to work with. So everything going to be much smoother and we going to reach longer.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (12:12):
Awesome. Yes. All right. Well, thank you for listening to the Evangelism Podcast, brother Pair. I celebrate the great history of Joshua campaign and I look forward to see what God does in the next few years. Wonderful.
Per Akvist – The Joshua Campaign (12:23):
Pray for my Throat though.
(12:24):
Yes, sir. <Laugh>, thank you. Bless you.
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Suraphael Demissie | Prophet to Ethiopia
Suraphael is a prophet in the nation of Ethiopia. He leads Presence TV which is a 24 hour television station in Ethiopia. In today’s episode of The Evangelism Podcast he says that Jesus is coming soon and the church needs to work hard to lead people to Jesus.
See the ministry of Suraphael Demissie on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@PRESENCETVCHANNEL
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King, and I’m excited about telling people about Jesus. Today I have a very special guest with me, prophet cfe from Addis Ababa, Ethiopia. Thank you so much for being on the Evangelism Podcast.
Suraphael Demissie (00:14):
I’m so happy to meet you.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:16):
Oh, it’s so good to be here with you. We have just landed here in Addis Ababa. We are here for a great gospel crusade in Kemba. Yes, Ethiopia. I’ve come here to the nation many times. This will be my 10th crusade, I believe, in the nation of Ethiopia. Wow. AndI’m here at the invitation of Per Akvist in the Joshua Campaign. They’ve done many crusades across Ethiopia and he’s a good friend of yours. Yes. And, and so we, we you have together, we we ate dinner tonight. Yeah. And you are telling me some about what God is doing here in Ethiopia. Brother, tell me, what is God doing in this nation?
Suraphael Demissie (00:59):
I have heard about you, pastor and you ministry for the last 10 years, maybe more than that. You had a conference here in Tokyo. What you are seeing here in physical and spiritual change, you have a effort. You have a foot, I mean, hand print on this blessing. So as, as a pastor, Ethiopian pastor as a nation, I have to say thank you first about your work and your ministry in Ethiopia. And so many souls, new souls come to Jesus. You win a lot of new souls so many people get healed, delivered. So it’s a great thing, you know, in <inaudible> Jesus to the people of Ethiopia. So on behalf of Ethiopia, we say thank you. Oh, thank you. Let me come to the, the question what we are seeing here in, to all the world what God is doing and the Holy Spirit in doing it, show that our king Jesus Christ is coming. Hallelujah.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (02:14):
Amen.
Suraphael Demissie (02:15):
Yeah. We are the servant. We are the missioners of the last age, the last days. So gospel in Ethiopia is is burning and is dominating the country. So our government, our prime minister all the government of shall become follower Jesus Christ. There they become believers. So it implied that gospel please doing great here in Ethiopia and changes so many lives.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (02:55):
Now you have a multifaceted ministry here. You have a church in Hawassa. You have built a beautiful church building here in Addis Ababa. Thank you. And you also have a television ministry called Presence. Yes. And referring to the presence of God. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And so a few moments ago when we prayed together in your auditorium, I was praying that God would fill the place with his presence. And I didn’t even know that was the name of your TV channel. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But it goes 24 hours a day. And because of that, you have become very well known here in Ethiopia. When people hear that you’re are coming, many come to to hear the word of the Lord. And so God has raised you up as a prophet, but you really started your ministry just by putting some videos up on YouTube. Yes. And you were telling me that you went into a internet cafe mm-hmm. <Affirmative> back before there was internet available all over the place. You just went into an internet cafe. And how did you start your YouTube channel?
Suraphael Demissie (04:00):
Thank you for asking me my humble beginning. Yeah. I appreciate it. You know, 10, 10 years ago I was graduating from University of Adi Ababa. When I was in the, in the university, I was a Christian students fellowship leader. I, I used to serve in the fellowship. Then God called me to serve him. So I didn’t go to any office or I didn’t find any job, but I was praying and fasting two years. Then God show me a v a vision with the vision was like I saw in the dream. I saw a big stadium and full of people. And the people who were in the stadium, they were crying and worshiping God and they were watching a video. So I was eager to see that video. And when I closed on the video and when I saw the preacher, that was me.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (05:01):
Wow. So God gave you a vision of your future ministry?
Suraphael Demissie (05:04):
Yes. So I saw a dream about my ministry before I start my ministry. Then I go, only when I wake up from the bed, I prayed and I go to straight to the Internet cafe and ask them to open me a YouTube account. Then they open me, they sign me to a YouTube account, and they give me the password. Then I was a singer, so I had the songs. Then I upload on the YouTube some of my songs, and people were so blessed, and they ask me more and more. Then I start to upload my old sermons, my preg, my songs. Then after it become like boom. So now we have like 340,000 subscribers on TV and hundred million views on YouTube. So my humble beginning is like this.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (05:59):
I, like you say, boom, <laugh>, God made it happen. Yes. And I think that is so beautiful because you were willing to serve the Lord looking for any way that you could serve, and you just go open a YouTube channel. They give you the password. And now over 314,000 subscribers, over 100 million views, people all over the world, the, the Ethiopian dra dra Yes. Who are all over the world are, are watching and hearing the, the word of the Lord. Yes. On the YouTube channel. And I was watching one of the videos of one of the, the Crusades that you did in Hosana. Yes. And it looked like there were thousands of people there. What did God do?
Suraphael Demissie (06:44):
Yeah. Hosana, the, the more Christian dominating country, which is in thousand part of Ethiopia. So God in the mid nineties spokes to me about hosana, go to Hosana because I have history in God hosana. That’s not my birthplace, or that’s not my, I was raised, but one time, like seven years ago, I went to Hosana for singing. And at that night I was praying, God use me or kill me because I was so give up on ministry. I start my ministry, but the ministry was not going like what I was expecting. So I cried all the night and I said, make it or break it. Kill me or use me. Then I slept. When I woke up from my bed, I, I prayed and I, I go to the, the crusading, Hona I was invited. So when I start to sing, God opens my spiritual eyes and ears, and I saw so many visions. Then after, after that day onwards, I become like a prophet, prophet, prophetic ministry starts in my life, you know? So I have to pay back for God. I want, I want to thank God in that place. So the spirit of God told me, go to Hosana and thank me. Then when I go to Hosana, maybe 1 million people was gathered. So many miracles happened. Wow. So many <inaudible> gets the Muslims, the Orthodox. So this was a history in so powerful conference.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (08:31):
It’s so amazing what God is doing here in Ethiopia. God is raising this church up, and I believe that God is making you a voice, not just to Ethiopia, not just to Africa, but to the whole world. And so you serve God as a pastor. I think you have also been used by God as an evangelist, but God has given you this gift as a, a prophet. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, what is the word of the Lord for the body of Christ today. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. What, what is God speaking to you as a prophet
Suraphael Demissie (09:03):
About this,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:04):
A about what he wants to do in the world during this time. Mm-Hmm.
Suraphael Demissie (09:09):
<Affirmative>, you know, Jesus is coming soon.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:11):
Amen.
Suraphael Demissie (09:12):
Hallelu, our king will see him so and versa. So
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:17):
I know you are a true prophet because that is what God is saying. Jesus is coming soon. He says, behold I come quickly.
Suraphael Demissie (09:23):
Hallelujah. So Jesus is edifying the church. He’s pride.
(09:30):
So we are like hand lake, leg, iron, ear for Jesus. So on, in the, on the last days, Jesus want to use us by his mighty power. You know for the sake of gospel, God do not restrict his his power. You know, he release whatever he has because this is the last time. So the last calling, the last message is preaching now. So God is speaking and working in this case mightly. So so many people is coming to Jesus. We see so many revivals in a world like Asbury University, like, you know, in a different corner of the world. So Jesus is coming soon. We are preaching that. So we expect so many lives
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (10:27):
Come Jesus. Amen. I believe that is right on mm-hmm. <Affirmative> with what God is saying. Jesus is coming soon. Yes. And we need to make every single second count for God. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Well, thank you so much, brother, for being on the Evangelism podcast. If someone is looking for your YouTube channel mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, how do they find it? What is your name on the YouTube channel?
Suraphael Demissie (10:48):
Presence TV channel, worldwide
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (10:50):
Presence TV Channel Worldwide. So I encourage you go and subscribe to the YouTube channel. Receive a blessing from the man of God. And Brother, could we finish today by asking you to pray for those who are watching? Yes. But don’t pray in English. I want you to pray in [inaudible] and just pray a blessing. Amen. Over those who are watching, that God will bless them.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:46):
Amen. Thank you, brother for being on the Evangelism Podcast.
Suraphael Demissie (11:48):
Thank you for giving me this chance. God bless you. God bless you.
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Barry Meguiar | From Car Crazy to Jesus Crazy
Barry Meguiar is famous for his Car Wax business and for his Car Crazy television show that aired for 18 years on the Discovery Channel. But his real passion is making Jesus famous. On today’s episode of The Evangelism Podcast, he talks about how God can use a businessman to share the Gospel with people who need Jesus.
Questions for Barry Meguiar:
- How can God use a businessman to lead people to Jesus?
- What advice would you give to other businessmen who want to share their faith?
- Tell me about your mandate to move everyone, everyday, closer to Jesus.
- What do you mean when you say that “Sharing your faith is not a “Yikes!” but a “Wow!”
- Why do you consider witnessing to be a “team sport?”
- Why did God tell you to make “your business your pulpit?”
Learn more about Barry Meguiar at: igniteamerica.com
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
Barry McGuire is famous for his car wax business and for his “Car Crazy” television show that aired for 18 years on the Discovery Channel. But his real passion is making Jesus famous. On today’s episode of the Evangelism Podcast, he talks about how God can use a businessman to share the gospel with people who need Jesus.
Evangelism Podcast Host (00:39):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast with Dr. Daniel King, where Daniel interviews full-time evangelists, pastors, missionaries, and normal everyday Christians to discover how they share their faith, their powerful testimonies, and amazing stories that will inspire you to reach people with the good news. And now here’s your host, missionary, and evangelist Daniel King.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:03):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King and I’m excited about telling people about Jesus. Today I have a very special guest, Barry McGuire. He is a car wax businessman who also had a tremendous car show called Car Crazy on Discovery Channel for many years. But the thing that he’s really excited about is evangelism. Mr. Berry, thank you so much for being on the Evangelism Podcast.
Barry Meguiar (01:33):
Thank you. Greatly honored. And we are soulmates in every respect. We’ve not met me each other before, but we are, we are definitely soulmates. I love everything you say and do I just say it? Amen. Amen. Amen. And and thank you for all that you’re doing and the people you’re influencing to get off the bench and into the game.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:51):
Well, thank you. Just a couple of weeks ago, I was with Steve Strang from Charisma Media and I interviewed him for the Evangelism Podcast. And he says, now I got a guy that you have to meet Barry McGuire. We’re publishing a book for him and he is an evangelist through and through. People think he’s a car guy, but really he’s excited about evangelism. And so,
Barry Meguiar (02:14):
Well, I’m both, I’m both. I am a car guy. I love my business. I love waxing eloquent on cars. And I’m a part of this. There’s 30 million car guys just in the United States. And I love this community. I tend, I often meet Christians at car Guy events and, and the best thing in the world is be Christian, know the Lord and, and be able to enjoy the car hobby because the car, people in the car hobby are really quite special and they’re really exhibiting everything. The scriptures tell us to do. I mean, they’re the most generous, caring people on a global basis. There’s, there’s something about the DNA of a car guy. I know it’s hard for you to understand a few moments, but it’s, it’s crazy. The problem is this, most car guys are so good. They think they’re on their way to heaven because they’re good.
(03:01):
And I find it’s easier to reach a scoundrel with a gospel <laugh> than, than it is a lot of car guys who some, I, I call it chumming. I’m always throwing out chum, you know, just try to get the, get their hunger going. And some, I’ve been doing that for 20, 30 years and they’re just so good. They can’t conceive him of God, who would, who would send them to hell. And I say, he didn’t send you to hell, he didn’t send anybody to hell, you know, but you have to make a choice, you know, and they know who Jesus is. They would swear to Sac of Bible, Jesus, the Son of God. They know that. They, they know that. But the thought of bowing down to him and bending their knees and and giving control of their life horses, it’s because they’ve got, you know, a lot of car rides have, they can do about anything they wanna do. And it just breaks my heart that they could hold onto this world so tightly. Like it’s never gonna go away, but it’s falling apart all around us. So I, I often say even so, a couple more Jesus, but then immediately say, wait a minute, <laugh>, I got too many people. I gotta get on the bus before we get for before we’re outta here. You know, so you know what I’m talking about.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (04:08):
That’s awesome. Well, I really wanted to ask your perspective as a businessman, cuz a lot of people, they have a, a sense that the great commission telling people about Jesus is the job of the evangelist. Someone like me or like a a pastor, someone who is in the clergy. But you’ve been a businessman your whole life, and yet God has used you in a powerful way in the area of business. How can God use a businessman to bring people to Jesus?
Barry Meguiar (04:40):
Well, first off, let me say, I think you clarified it about us anyway, as well as anybody there, there’s the evangelist, the people that are called to be an evangelist, okay? Then there’s a work of evangelism that we’re all called to. And we are, we’re all, all of us are in full-time ministry. I say, you know, you’re in full-time ministry, whether you like it or not. Everything you say or do is moving people closer or further away from God. If you’re a Christian, people are watching you. And everything you say and do is moving whether you want to or not. You can’t get away from it. <Laugh> you can’t get, you can’t escape it. Everything you say and do is moving everybody watching you closer or further away from God. I often also say you are a witness. You’re already a witness. You may be a witness for the prosecution, <laugh>, but you’re a witness.
(05:28):
People are judging are, are, are making their decision on God based on what they’re saying with Christians. Of course, we know that that’s a pretty sad state right now because most people don’t wanna be like Christians. They look in, they call ’em, I had one last sign I was talking to out in the street, and I, I want God, but I don’t wanna be with Christians. I hate Christians. What a, what a clear, pure commentary on where the church is today. We don’t realize how easily we, we move people away from God. You know, the most common one would be after church on Sunday. We go to church, we go to church, we go out afterwards, probably several of us in a little larger group, a little more demanding, stay a little longer than we should. Talking about God, the waiters server knows they we’re from the church.
(06:17):
You know, my, here, there we go again. And then when they leave, they stiff the waiter, you know? Yeah, dude, they just move that server closer, further away from without even realizing it. Praise God. All right, see you later, <laugh>. And this person, that’s a soul that God loves. It’s just been left devastated. Servers don’t like to work on Sunday afternoons because of church people. So there’s, there’s all kinds of ways that share our faith is that, that non-verbal and, and verbal. But the point is, you gotta be in intent. You gotta realize we’re full-time. It’s full-time. It’s not, not part-time. There’s nothing that you and I do, nothing any of us do is Christians. That’s secular. We meet secular appeal, but there’s no such secular, secular conversation. Every conversation, every intonation, everything we’re doing is sacred. It’s, it’s an opportunity to move in closer to Jesus when you realize that it changes your life.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (07:10):
Now, one of the things I really liked about your new book, ignite Your Life, is that this book is chock full of anecdotes, stories about people that you met, that you helped bring closer to Jesus. Can you share some of those stories with us and, and, and, and tell us about how you can bring people closer to Jesus?
Barry Meguiar (07:31):
Well, first off, you know, the, one of the biggest misconceptions about face sharing is that you’re supposed to share with them and get them on the knees and pray the sins prayer, one step <laugh>. And I started out that way, and I still find people today that think that’s, that’s, that’s the norm. And of course, it’s absurd. It’s, it’s God’s timing. And the average person takes, you know, it’d be 20 encounters before they finally accept the Lord. And we don’t know where we are. Along the scripture’s very clear in that some, some over the seed, so is on, on hard ground. And some it’s furled and some it’s shallow. And so, I mean, that’s, that’s what the scripture say. If we follow what the scripture say, we pretty much ignore about everything. All the evangelism programs say like, you know, get one person saved today.
(08:16):
Okay, well, out of all the people I’m gonna be with today that are going to hell I’m supposed to pick one. Okay? how do I pick that one? And, and then what about all the others? I just let them go to hell. <Laugh>, I mean, help me, help me with this, you know, and living a good life. Most Christ think share living a good life is, is sharing your faith. But living a good life doesn’t get you or anybody else in to heaven. And yet, most evangelicals, I don’t know what that term means anymore, but most people that call themselves evangelicals think that just being good will will get them there. And we’ll move people closer. So if, if attach God to all the good they were doing, we’d be a Christian world because we are doing a lot of good.
(09:00):
But, but it makes us, puffs us up and we feel really good about doing good, you know, and say, well, God must be really proud of you. I was really generous right then. But it brings us glory and not them. So how do you connect? And, and, and I’m sorry, but recitation of a script doesn’t seem to do that real well. I I, I thank God for evangelism approvals. I really do. I know millions of people been brought to the Lord, but because of them, but most of ’em don’t. Most of us don’t go to evangelism programs and we’re not trained. So how do we do it? The real,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:32):
Yeah. I really like one, one story that you shared in here. You said you’re going through an evangelism script and you’d always get to like the second step and you’d lose your place. And then the person you’re talking to would ask a completely different question. You then you’d get mad at them and mad at God. Oh, no. Because they weren’t sticking with the script, and then you’d try and bring them back. All right? So if, if you don’t have a script, how do you live Jesus from the inside so that you can be led in the right direction to helping people come closer to Jesus?
Barry Meguiar (10:02):
That’s, that’s the key question. And, and it comes to me in several ways. You know what Jesus said? They’ll, they’ll know, you’re my disciple by how well you recite your script. No, not actually, no <laugh>, you know, he said, don’t know. You’re my decided by your love. We don’t need training to love on people. And everybody’s starving for love. And when you love on people when they’re hurting, they won’t turn to tears pretty quickly. It’s amazing. People have this smile, but just right on. That’s why we see so much anger today. You do just a little thing wrong. He gets shot today. I mean the, there’s this veneer of smile, but underneath there’s hurt. And when you come to them, not in anger, but you come to them in love, the Holy Spirit confirms it to them. You know, Jerry Root, the author of the Sacrament of Evangels, you probably read that book when he talks about how God’s already celebrated working with each person. When we come in, we enter into the sacred moment, we’re becoming a, a physical manifestation of what God is already putting in their hearts. So it’s this, the every relation, every conversation is, is amazing. And when you love on people, they just, they just open up. Let’s see if I can thi I mean, there’s, they’re <laugh>. I got a million of ’em. I’ve done, Karen and I have been sharing our faith every day for 50 years. Okay,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:21):
That’s amazing. And
Barry Meguiar (11:23):
And because of that, he’s done some amazing things with our lives and our business and whatever. But well, I tell you, I I, I jumped in a taxi one day. I was the Marriott Hotel downtown Detroit. I was going to Cobo Hall, and it was a five minute walk, but it was seven degrees, okay? <Laugh>. So I I jumped in, I said, Hey, I just gotta get a short ride, but I give you a big tip. The guy yells at me, I don’t want a tip. What <laugh>, I don’t want a tip. Excuse me, sir, why don’t you want a tip? I’m a bad person. I don’t deserve a tip. That’s he yelled at. Worse than that, you know, talk about hurting. I, I got so many stories like this. But here’s the thing, mark 1311 says don’t prepare. How do you prepare for those conversations?
(12:12):
You can’t listen. So step one, <laugh>. Oh, and then Luke 1212 says, I’ll give you the word to say when you need them. And that’s the fun part of it, folks, when you just step in and just do it, there’s no preparation that you have nothing. All of a sudden you’re face to face with somebody and their son just committed suicide. Or if they just got the call, they got cancer. I mean, you can’t prepare those conversations. And when you just love on them and tear with them and generally love on them, and then the Holy Spirit gives you the words to say it’s, it’s the craziest thing. There’s no other way to have this kind of intimacy with God than to allow God to speak to you. See this life in front of you changing. In this case, I said this, man do you know God loves you?
(12:56):
No <laugh>. I said, yeah, he loves you. No, he just, he’s so angry, poor man. I said, sir, I I, I’m a student of the Bible. I’m a Christian and I know the Bible really well, and I can tell you for sure absolutely positive, he loves you. Now. He says nothing. I said, you know what? Even, even better do, do you know he loves you as much? He’s ever loved anybody ever dead quiet. I said, you know, it gets even better than that. You know, he loves you. I’m laughing, telling him, I said, do you realize that God loves you as much as he loves his own son, Jesus Christ, that’s how much he loves you. Dead quiet over now, where Coha I get out, it’s snowing. I remember the salt in the windows, the windows going down. He’s looking at me like He <laugh>, he’s speechless.
(13:49):
He’s never heard this. He thinks God hates you. It’s over. And I said, you know sir, God put me in your taxi just now because he wants you to know that he loves you and he wants you to spend attorney with him. And then I gave him a really big tip. I said, God bless you. Have a great day, <laugh>. And I walked, yes, <laugh>. Did I get him saved? Of course not. Did I move him closer to Jesus? You better believe it. I may have stayed you committing suicide that day. And so that basic theme, there’s so many ways to say that never. People come in, they, they have this sentence, they set ’em, everybody, if you were to die today, do you know you go to heaven? Whatever. They’re, they have a million of these things and they do every over and over with everybody.
(14:34):
Well, everybody is an everybody. Each person’s an individual. And you allow the Holy Spirit. And the moment you go to script, it gets plastic. It’s static. Cuz something, it’s like you just say it because that’s what you’re supposed to say. But when you love on people, when we love on our friends, we don’t recite a script, have anything prepared. We just love on them. We’re broken for them. And when we do that, people break and they, within five minutes, they’re telling you, you know how it works. Within five minutes, they’re telling you things they won’t tell their best friends. And then you know the point of need. Then God gives you the scriptures and you see the change in front of your eyes and you’re praying, you’re hugging. I I, I pulled up the other day in front of a, a restaurant, my friend, it was kind of an open parking lot, but for some reason he pulled this place right in front of us was a, was a black guy and a tank top tattoo, dreadlocks, all filling his radiator with a great big bottle of water, <laugh>, you know, so I, I said, Hey, can I help you?
(15:33):
He said, no, I got under control. I just have a leaky radiator and I just driven here from Alabama and just, just got in town and I just made sure I had to make sure I have a lot of water. And I said, so what you doing? So I found out that he left his wife and and daughter at home to get a job. He found he could drive a truck if you driven a truck. No, but I have a friend here. He says, I can drive a truck. All of a sudden I’m talking about God’s plan for his life. And he’ll, God wants to guide and direct him and take all that fear off and help. When I was a kid, I didn’t know what I was doing, and I didn’t know where I was gonna go. I had, I was kinda the same situation.
(16:06):
I just prayed, you know, trust the Lord with your whole heart game, all this stuff. Before we know it, we’re praying, he’s hugging me, <laugh>. And then we have a little card we give people. At the end of every conversation like that, we have a little card says, seeking God, little business card, seeking God. You can order ’em for free. There’s, there’s no cost to, and it’s a robust site that tells them everything they need to know. It’s testable, these videos to buy whatever. It would take them easily from no knowledge of God to the sinners prayer. And so rather than just leaving somebody like that well, I hope they find a church somewhere. You give them the card and say, would you like to know more about God? They say, yes. I said, oh, here’s a card. You can have it tell you everything you want to know. I mean,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (16:49):
That’s amazing
Barry Meguiar (16:50):
Privilege of doing that. It’s so, it’s so much fun. It gives you joy when you’re, when you’re bearing fruit. John 1511 says, when you bear fruit, my joy remain with you. And, and your joy remain full. If you wanna have joy, this who, who knew <laugh> having joy is directly connected with bearing fruit, with loving our neighbors. It is the great commission after all,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (17:12):
<Laugh>. Yeah, your joy is really infectious. It makes me want to go out and, and witness right now and lead someone to Jesus. Because you’re right, the Bible says that all the angels of heaven rejoice when one sinner gets saved. And there’s no feeling like that feeling of, of bringing someone to the point where they, they make Jesus the Lord of their life and they turn away from hell and turn towards heaven. I mean, that is such a, a joyful occasion. Another idea that you have, that I really love is that you consider witnessing to be a team sport. Can you explain what that means and, and why you feel that it’s a team sport?
Barry Meguiar (17:50):
Yeah, well, take the gentleman and the and and the taxi driver. You know, did I get him saved? No, I I, I maximized my time with him. I had a five minute window and I moved him down the line that didn’t get him saved. But God is sovereignly moving each person. And it is a team sport. It is a team sport. What if I, on the times when I lead somebody, the Lord, and that’s a very small percentage of all the people I talk with, but I know there, there may have been 20 people before me, so I’m celebrating not that look what I did, but look what God did through a whole bunch of us, and we won’t know till we get to heaven. All the people played a, a role in that, you know? So yeah, God uses Christians, he brings us in.
(18:33):
He orchestrates their steps and or steps. It’s amazing how that happens. I mean, I got all kinds of stories and I can tell you one just real quick. I, I was going to dinner and I had to get their first so I could give the waiter my credit card before my friend got, there was always a contest between who and to get the bill, right? So my Uber app didn’t work. I said, Karen, we gotta get outside the hotel to, to so the Uber app worked, so we get out. It didn’t work outside either. So Karen says better, you better get that taxi right there. So I said, okay, Sarah, I I, I’ll take that taxi. He says, that taxi’s smoking for, well, there was nobody around me. I said, spoken for. He says, yeah, look back. There’s a lady way back at the right by the front door.
(19:14):
And it was her taxi. I said, well, how long will it take to get a taxi? He’s owe about 15 minutes. Becauses a busy time. And, and I blood star. I said, <laugh>, I gotta get to this restaurant, right? So finally I hear, sir, sir, and I turned around and this lady, and she says, just take my taxi. I said, w why would I do that? She’s my husband’s upstairs. I don’t know what he’s doing. <Laugh>, I don’t know how long you can just take this taxi. I’ll take the next taxi. I said, okay. We’d jump in the taxi and burp. We’re spinning rubber of the guy in, in his first sentence of profanity. What the hell? You know, where, where the hell do you wanna go? I forget how he said it. It was just like, wow. So we started, God
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (19:59):
Brought us another one.
Barry Meguiar (20:01):
He brought us another one. You know, I mean, it’s so much fun. If you, if you’re not thinking about Spur, you’re saying, let me get out of this car as fast as I can. But when you have these things, how do you realize God’s in it? It’s like an adventure. It’s so you ask questions and you find out his wife just died from painful cancer. Agging cancer she’d been through for months, couldn’t stop the pain she had just died. He had to work. His kids were outta control and total com, com rebellion. He was just beside himself. And God gave you the script just so easy. He just effortly say, effortly say, I said, Jesus, you know, Jesus says, come under me all who are all of you who are heavy burden, and I’ll give you rest burden, heavy aid. I’ll give you rest.
(20:45):
And he yells at the same intensity, man, do I need to rest <laugh>. So we’re, we’re feeding him scriptures, Karen and I both, we finally get there, we get outta the taxi. And I said to him, he said, I need to get in church. I said to him, if, if you would trust me with your, where, where you live and your cell number, I’ll find a church for you and, and send it to you. So you know we’re, oh, would you do that? So he’s writing it all down. I said, can I pray for you? He said, yes. So the three of us in front of the headlights of the taxi, in front of the restaurant, people walking in, and we laughed later about how that must have looked and we’re praying and we’re all tearing and just, just emotionally involved with each other. My point is this, he, he had to stop my Uber app.
(21:30):
Think of what he went through for that. That guy was hungry for God. He didn’t know, but he was hungry for God. He was right. So he, God starts my Uber app from working. He keeps the, the gal’s husband upstairs, right? He gives her the generosity, say, go ahead and take my taxi. And then it happened to be his taxi at that moment who look at all he orchestrated, make it so I had the opportunity to share it with him. I didn’t know the end of the story. There’s other people involved, other team players in the part of that story who know glory. But to be a part of the team and, and just get off the bench. If you’re sitting on the bench, you at to peak and, and everything falls apart, you no longer have hunger for the word. You’re no longer praying, everything falls down.
(22:14):
You’re at worry. 80% of all Christians are in fear right now, living in fear right now. It’s tragedy. But when you’re sharing your faith, nobody has to tell you to read your Bible. Man, you’re digging as fast as you can, try to get answers to all the questions. And you being asked, you say, God, help me. I don’t know what I’m doing. Help me. Thank you for ringing Bob into my life. And I pray and you’re praying and everything’s working. It’s the whole, your whole spiritual life is working. You’re alive. That’s why he says he wants us to share of faith. And I’ll give you one last scripture, which is powerful. Do you know, there’s actually a scripture says, why from from Genesis to Revelations. He says, do it. But in Isaiah 43 10, he says, why? He says, I appoint you as my witness so that you’ll believe, so that you’ll believe. Now I would say so that they will believe. No, he says so and he didn’t say this show. You’ll believe more. He says so that you will believe. That’s why he wants you to share your faith. Because once you step into that world, your entire life changes. And it’s joy every day. Every day is joy. It’s adventure. It’s, it’s ignites your life. That’s a good name for a book Ignites Your Life, <laugh>,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (23:25):
Hey, that is a good name for a book. And you’ve written it, ignite your life. Now, one of the things about car Guys is that you, you never have to convince a car guy to talk about his car. All you do is ask the first question and then they can talk forever about all the details, everything they’ve upgraded and, and polished and made it in
Barry Meguiar (23:45):
Minutia. Yes,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (23:46):
<Laugh>. And, and I think the same should be true as Christians. We shouldn’t fear sharing our faith with others. If you love Jesus as much as a car guy loves his car, then you’ll talk about Jesus everywhere you go. Do you think that’s true?
Barry Meguiar (24:01):
Oh God, there’s no question. It’s, it’s true. Here’s the point. Whatever you’re excited about to talk about, I’m excited about cars, I’m excited about shiny finishes. So I love talking to you about how I can make a perfect finish in your car. Use McGuire’s car wax. It will look like a jewel. And I, I’m so excited about talking about that. I’m excited about that. So I talk about it a lot. Question for all of you listening to us right now, or are you, are you talking about God much? If, if you’re not talking about God much, you, I’m not saying you’re not going to heaven, you’re on your way to heaven, but I’m talking about having fun and doing what you’re supposed to do. If you’re talking about God, if you’re not talking about God, then he probably is no longer your first love.
(24:45):
And the easiest way to describe that is a new Christian, you know, a new Christian. You can’t stop them from sharing their faith because God, you just save me for help. <Laugh>, I’m on my way to heaven. He’s my first love. So next year you’re gonna share it, you know, and in, at the letter, in the letter to the church at Ephesus, in the revelations chapter two, he says, I, I, I thank, I know you’re doing all the good stuff and you give sacrificially, you know, good teaching for bad, you know all that. You’re there, but I have this against you. You’ve left your first love and, and you’re no longer doing the first work. The first thing every Christian does is share their faith. If you’re no longer loving him first, then you’re no longer sharing him. So if you go to Romans that’s repeated over and over, love your neighbor as yourself, as you’re, if you’re as concerned for your neighbor as you are for yourself, as concerned for their salvation as you are for yourself, you, you, that’ll, your whole conversation will be different, right?
(25:43):
You, you’ll do everything you can to get them into heaven. So you’ll fulfill all 10 commandments because of the two. Because now it’s not out of obligations, because I don’t wanna do anything. Can I indulge and do that? Can I look at that? Can I laugh at go to heaven? Yeah, sure. But does that helping you get people to Jesus? That’s the question. And the big one is Romans a 28, probably the most, maybe the second most well-known and mis misunderstood scripture in the Bible where he says, I’ll make God sense. He doesn’t lie. I’ll make everything in your life work together for good. Wow. Take if you knew God was going to make everything work for good in your life, even the bad stuff, take everything. That’s his promise to you. But there’s two things you have to do to get there. One is God, having him His first love, loving him more than anything else, nothing separating us.
(26:32):
And secondly, in the part that’s hardly ever preached, if you love me, to those who love me, to those who live for my purpose, not your purpose, stop trying to find your purpose. He didn’t have a purpose for you. He has a plan for you to fulfill his purpose. His, there’s no question on that theologically, his purpose is to seek and save the loss. And so when you live your life to seek and save the loss, to live your neighbor as yourself, to love God first and do the first work it all, the whole weight of scripture comes down to this point. When you do that, then you’re in sync with God, and then you have God flowing through you. And that’s when you know nobody can take your faith away from you. 80% of Christians need to hear this today. 80% of Christians are living in fear.
(27:21):
If you’re living in fear, you can’t li you’re not living in faith. If you don’t have faith, you can’t share your faith. That’s the bottom line for us. We gotta get people out of fear. And it’s so easy. Just do the basic simple things. God tells to do love on people. I had, I had a lady at, at our home this weekend and a great duress. She loves the Lord, but save just having a heyday with her. And it was so easy to change her from this, this poor me thing, folks. She was just confessing, confessing, confessing, bad stuff, all this bad stuff, you know better than this. You know, the scriptures, let me just remind you. And over a period of a day, all of a sudden, she just, she just hugged me before I, I came and joined you. She goes, I can’t join.
(28:07):
I got my mojo back. I’m back. I’m good. I just <laugh>. And it was just understanding the truth that she already knew. It. It’s, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s like Pat Boone wrote a book a long time ago. It’s like having a big check account and not cashing any checks with it. God wants to pour out his blessings on us, but we restrict him by our lack of faith. If we don’t have, if we don’t have faith, if we’re wavering, if we’re part of the 80% that have fear, then we follow that category in James one where he says, if you’re wavering, I don’t, I don’t, don’t expect me to answer any of your prayers. You may be praying like crazy. I’ve done that in the past. I’ve been 50 years doing this. And I went through a two and a half period year period where I was worrying like crazy.
(28:48):
I was trusting, I knew God was solve, put solve the problems sometime, but I was worrying like crazy in the meantime. And a preacher on the radio said to me, said one day as I was driving down the street, who’s your God? I, well, I got that one straight. Okay, that one, he’s, I ain’t gonna have to get Who’s your God? I thought, oh, I’ve heard f i I started change the, I’ll tell you who’s your God, but whatever feels your prayers is your God. And we are so easily prone to pray for this ministry or this urgency, or this problem, or this cancer or whatever the problem is. And it’s like, God, help us, help me with my God <laugh>, you just can’t do that. God is God. He will never let us down. And when, when we’re in perfect harmony with God, when we live for his purpose, to seek and save the loss, and when you do that, it, it ignites your life, guaranteed. It’s so simple, <laugh>.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (29:43):
That’s awesome. Well, as a minister, I wanna say thank you to you as a businessman because over the years you’ve been very successful in business, but you haven’t just kept all your success for yourself. You’ve also done a, you’ve helped so many other ministries. You’ve helped James Dobson with Focus on the Family, David Wilkerson, the Assemblies of God Missions Board. You have poured your time and talents back into the kingdom of God. And I think that’s so valuable for businessmen to understand that they have a very essential role to play in the kingdom of God. And, and so what advice would you give to businessmen who want to be used by God in a powerful way?
Barry Meguiar (30:25):
What a great question. You know, at, at one point I thought God was calling me into full-time ministry. And it was, believe it or not, it was 1976, okay? 1976. And I, I prayed the most fervor fair of my life. I, I, I love my business, I love everything about my business. I, I, I could see where we were just starting retail. Now we’re the number one selling car wax in the country right there. We’re just starting. And I had this dream, I believe God gave it to me. This was my baby. But I was feeling like he was taking me into full-time ministry because I was having so much fun sharing my faith. And so I prayed, I said, God, if you want me to leave my business and go into full-time ministry, I will do that. I, I said it through tears.
(31:10):
I will do that, but I’m almost gonna have to hear from you with an audible voice because I need to know for sure. And if it’s for sure that I’m gone, I’m, I’m with you all the way either whatever way you want me to go. So about 20 minutes later, a a a guy came into my office, secretary said, there’s a Dave MCT here to see you. And I thought, well, that’s strange. I knew this guy. I didn’t really know this guy. He, he, he tended my church, but I didn’t know him. He’d spoken from the platform a couple times. So I knew he was a missionary kid, grew up in Africa about my same age, but I’d never even exchanged a glance with him. Here he is walking into my office. And I said, well, hi Dave, how you doing? He, I was in the area, thought I’d stop by and just ask how’s, how’s it going?
(31:54):
So I made a snap decision. He wasn’t into shiny paint finishes. So I, I started telling you about experience I was having, and this was the defining moment of my life. And I think it answers your question. He said, God’s given you a wonderful ministry here, hadn’t he? I said, wait a minute, maybe after you pray the prayer, that was a pretty astounding statement. He was raise, I’d seen them overlapping, but still, I’m a businessman. I’m a Christian. I see these two different things. He, he says God’s given you a wonderful ministry here, hadn’t he? And I said, why would you say that? He said, well, a, a pastor can’t reach the people you’re reaching, but as a businessman, you can. And he gave me this line in 1976, it’s obvious that your business is your pulpit. Wo that means they’re overlapping.
(32:45):
There’s no separation. My business is my pulpit. Yeah, it was amazing. I just, oh my goodness. So I told you, I just prayed this prayer, not 20 minutes ago. He told that, explains it. I said, explains what? He always drive me up Red Hill. I just dropped missionaries off at Orange County Airport in Irvine. I was driving up Red Hill, the closest main street to my office. And he said, and God spoke to me and said, go see Barry McGuire. And I’d seen your building, I’d seen your name on it. I put together with the name at church. But I, I argue with God all the way to your office saying, I don’t know this guy. I don’t know what kind of business he’s in. I you gonna make a fool outta myself, but God wouldn’t let me go. What if he had not been obedient?
(33:28):
I I would’ve been a failure as a pastor, not a pastor. I’m a full-time ministry, whether I’m not a pastor, my business, my Pope, but wherever you are, folks, if you’re in business, your business is your pulpit. It’s secondary. Don’t ever let that capture your prayers and, and your joy. Don’t ever God, your joy’s in God. And we love him. The more I spent time serving him and sharing him, the more he blessed my business. Like there’s a wake behind me. I keep looking at, my business keeps getting bigger. Now I’m working hard for the business. But my joy, my everything, my focus is how can I, even when I get turned down in sales calls, my goal is I wanted to move them closer to Jesus <laugh>. I don’t care if I get the sale. Cause I know when I live that way, he promises me that everything’s gonna work for good.
(34:11):
You live in this promise. That promise is yours. He’s promising you, I’ll make everything your life work together for good if you, when you live for my purpose. It’s so simple. And, and who knew it works <laugh>. I mean, the scriptures actually work. And after 50 years in this tiny little business to where we are now and the influence we have to move people closer to Jesus. And it’s a joy. It’s just so much joy. Take my business away from me. Take my house. I don’t care. I got joy. You know? And it, it just ignites your life. I mean, I think you enjoy the book because it tells a lot of it. It’s, it’s a book of scriptures. The scriptures will set you free. The the scriptures will ignite your life. My life story is just trappings around it to kind of put in perspective what the word of God is really saying.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (34:58):
Well, if you’re listening, I encourage you to get a copy of the book. It’s called Ignite Your Life by Barry McGuire. This would be a great book to read. And if you have someone in your life who is enthusiastic about cars, maybe grandpa or an uncle who has a, an old car that they, they love to wax and polish, this would be a great book to give them, to be a witness to them. I, I guarantee they’ve heard of Barry McGuire and they, they would love hearing the story of how excited he is about sharing his faith. And if you wanna be excited about sharing your faith, get a copy of this book. It will really encourage you. I’d also encourage you to go to the website, ignite america.com for more information about Barry McGuire and Brother Barry, thank you so much for being on the Evangelism Podcast. I just love your enthusiasm. I love your joy, and it really is a pleasure to get to know you. God bless you,
Barry Meguiar (35:53):
Greatly honored, greatly honored. Bless you, Daniel.
Evangelism Podcast Host (35:55):
Is there evidence for God’s existence? How do we really know Jesus was raised from the dead? Can we trust the Bible? Do miracles happen? Does God care about me as an individual? In Dr. Daniel King’s book, proof God is real. You’ll find the answers to these three vital questions and more Is God there? Does God care? And do I dare to follow him? In his powerful, easy to read book, Daniel provides seven convincing proofs of God’s existence. You’ll learn about the evidence of cause. Design, logic, morality, scripture, miracles, and religious experience with proof God is real. You’ll read about topics like, was Jesus the son of God or just a crazy preacher? If God does exist, is he interested in your life? If God is there, why do bad things happen to good people? “Proof God is Real” Daniel King shows you, God is there and he cares for you. Plus, how to take a leap of faith and start a relationship with a God who deeply loves you. Order “Proof God is Real” today by calling 1-877-431-4276 or find the book on Amazon.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (36:58):
Thanks so much for listening today. I am excited about telling people about Jesus, and I want to invite you to be a part of helping us to rescue people from Hell and take them with us to heaven. There’s two things you can do to help. First of all, can you go find the Evangelism podcast on Apple iTunes and leave us a positive review by giving a review, you will help other people find these valuable resources about sharing our faith. And second, would you become a financial partner with King Ministries? Every single dollar that people give us enables us to lead at least one person to Jesus. And so that means for only $1, you can help start a party in heaven. And so today I want to invite you to become a monthly partner. You can start out for just a dollar, but if God puts it on your heart to do more, of course you can do more. But please go to king ministries.com and become a monthly partner with us today to help us to lead more people to Jesus. Thank you so much, and God bless you.
Evangelism Podcast Host (38:19):
For more information about how to share your faith or to financially support our worldwide evangelistic outreaches, visit king ministries.com. Again, that’s king ministries.com.
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Happy St. Patricks Day
Patrick (Late fifth century-461) is known as the Apostle of Ireland. Patrick was not the first missionary to Ireland, (he was preceded by Palladius) but he is the most influential Christian in the history of Ireland. Most of the bibliographical details of his life are known from his book, Confessions.
Patrick was born into a Christian family on the west coast of Great Britain (either Scotland or Wales). His father was a deacon in the Catholic church. At the age of sixteen, Patrick was captured by a raiding party of “Picts” who came like pirates on boats to loot villages near the coast line. He was taken to Ireland as a slave and sold to a man named Milchu. He was forced to care for his master’s sheep on the slopes of the Slemish Mountains.
For six years, he spent many cold and lonely nights with the sheep guarding them from wolves and bears. His only comfort was prayer. One night, God gave him a vision of a ship that was leaving Ireland. He took the vision as a sign from God and managed to escape his captors and board a ship that took him home to the joyful embrace of his family. A short time later, he became a priest and learned Latin and French.
During his time as a slave, he developed a close relationship with God and cultivated a dedication to prayer. He also learned the language and the culture of the Irish. After he escaped, he often prayed for the Irish people to be converted to Christianity.
In his book, he shares the story of a vision God gave him. He writes, “I saw a man coming, as it were from Ireland. His name was Victoricus, and he carried many letters, and he gave me one of them. I read the heading: “The Voice of the Irish”. As I began the letter, I imagined in that moment that I heard the voice of those very people who were near the wood of Foclut, which is beside the western sea—and they cried out, as with one voice: “We appeal to you, holy servant boy, to come and walk among us.”
Because of this vision, Patrick asked to be sent to Ireland. At first it was hard, but a fire burned in Patrick’s heart. He went from village to village in Ireland preaching the Gospel and baptizing new believers. His strategy was to convert the chief of each clan first, who would then use their influence to lead the whole clan to Christ. One of his first converts was his former master, Milchu. In each place where he found converts, he appointed deacons and established monasteries.
Patrick was effective because he contextualized the Gospel message for Irish culture instead of trying to force the Irish Christians to adopt the cultural practices of the Romans. Another reason his ministry was effective was because the Celtic Christians evangelized as a team by planting a monastery or church and living among the people they were trying to reach with the Gospel.
Legend says that St. Patrick drove all the snakes out of Ireland which is probably a myth but he did drive the devil from the island with his Gospel work. Patrick is also known for using the three-leaf Shamrock to illustrate the Trinity. The pagans and Druids of Ireland worshiped the sun and the moon, so he invented the Celtic Cross, which has a circle around the cross of Christ. Patrick died in Armaugh in 461 A.D. after spending 29 years as the Archbishop of Ireland.
Quotes from St. Patrick
I pray to God to give me perseverance and to deign that I be a faithful witness to Him to the end of my life for my God.
Christ before me, Christ behind me, Christ in me.
If I have any worth, it is to live my life for God so as to teach these peoples; even though some of them still look down on me.
Christ in the heart of every man who thinks of me, Christ in the mouth of everyone who speaks of me, Christ in every eye that sees me, Christ in every ear that hears me.
Ray Comfort | So Many Lions, So Few Daniels
Ray Comfort is a Christian evangelist and author who is known for his efforts to evangelize and defend the Christian faith. He is the founder and CEO of Living Waters, a ministry that focuses on evangelism and apologetics, and he is the co-host of the television program “The Way of the Master,” which teaches believers how to share the gospel with others.
Comfort was born in New Zealand in 1949 and became a Christian at the age of 18. He has written numerous books on the Christian faith, including “God Doesn’t Believe in Atheists,” “Hell’s Best Kept Secret,” and “Evolution: The Fairy Tale for Grownups.”
Comfort is known for his controversial and confrontational approach to evangelism and he is a significant figure in the world of Christian evangelism and apologetics. He often uses the Ten Commandments to share the Gospel. His YouTube channel has over 200,000,000 views.
On today’s Evangelism Podcast I Ray Comfort him some difficult questions about his theology, let’s hear how he answers them…
Learn more about Ray Comfort and the Living Waters Ministry: https://livingwaters.com/
Questions for Ray Comfort:
You have written over 100 books. What is unique about “So Many Lions, So Few Daniels”?
Let’s talk through a couple of scenarios of how you present the Gospel to people:
- You meet a guy on the street who loves to party. He is drinking and cussing. What do you say to him?
- You are affectionately known by atheists as “Banana Man” because of an illustration you once gave using a banana. You meet a girl who says she is an atheist. What do you say to her about her belief in evolution?
Why do you focus so much on the Ten Commandments in your witnessing?
I have two big questions about how you witness. The first big question is in how you begin your conversation and the second big question is in how you end your conversations.
- When you start witnessing, you usually emphasize the sinfulness of humanity instead of talking about the love of God. Bill Bright, who founded Campus Crusade for Christ, taught people to witness using the Four Spiritual Laws which starts with the idea that “God Loves You and He has a Wonderful Plan for Your Life.” Romans 2:4 says “The goodness of God leads you to repentance.” So why do you emphasize the law of God instead of the goodness of God?
- After you present the Gospel, I never see you ask people to pray a prayer of salvation. Why don’t you close the deal? Why don’t you pray a prayer of salvation with people or give altar calls? What is a false conversion?
The name of your TV program is “The Way of the Master.” When Jesus walked the earth, He healed lots of sick people so if you really want to follow the way of the Master, what role should miracles play in the ministry of the evangelist? When Philip the Evangelist preached in Samaria, many people were healed. Do you believe that God can use physical healing in order to draw people to Jesus?
Your first book is “Hell’s Best Kept Secret.” You are quite critical of large evangelistic meetings led by evangelists like Billy Graham and Luis Palau. You emphasize that with modern evangelistic methods, 80% of the people who are reported to be saved end up backsliding. What do you think is the solution to this problem?
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
His YouTube channel has over 200 million views. Ray Comfort is a Christian evangelist and author who is known for his efforts to evangelize and defend the Christian faith. He’s the founder and c e o of Living Waters, a ministry that focuses on evangelism and apologetics. And he’s the co-host of the television program, the Way of the Master, which teaches believers how to share the gospel with others. He was originally born in New Zealand. He became a Christian at the age of 18, and he’s written over a hundred books, including God Doesn’t Believe In Atheist, hell’s Best Kept Secret and Evolution, the Fairytale for Growing Up. Today we talk about his new book called So Many Lions, so Few Daniels Comfort is known for his controversial and confrontational approach to evangelism. He often uses the 10 Commandments to share the gospel. On today’s evangelism podcast, I ask Ray Comfort some difficult questions about his theology. Let’s hear how he answers my questions.
Evangelism Podcast Host (01:22):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast with Dr. Daniel King, where Daniel interviews full-time evangelists, pastors, missionaries, and normal everyday Christians to discover how they share their faith, their powerful testimonies, and amazing stories that will inspire you to reach people with the good news. And now here’s your host, missionary, and evangelist Daniel King.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:47):
Welcome to The Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King and I’m excited about telling people about Jesus. Today I have a very special guest with me, Ray Comfort. He is a phenomenal YouTube evangelist, over 200 million views on his YouTube channel. He goes out on the streets and tells people about Jesus. Brother, comfort, thank you so much for being with me today.
Ray Comfort (02:13):
It’s an honor to be with you, Daniel. Thanks to having me on.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (02:16):
Man, I have learned so much from your ministry over the years. I’ve watched many of your YouTube videos. I’ve been watching you go out on the street and talking to, to people, uh, about the, the 10 Commandments. And, uh, you have just, uh, published a new book. It’s called So Many Lions, so Few Daniels. Now, you’ve published over a hundred books. What is unique about this one?
Ray Comfort (02:47):
Well, it’s, I think it’s a book for our time. We are living in very, very dark times. Let me tell you what inspired me to write the book besides God, A Hope. Um, it was a poster or a t-shirt put out by atheists. It was, uh, too many Christians, not enough lions. And I thought, how sick is that? That’s like saying too many blacks, not enough lynching ropes, too many Jews, not enough Nazis, uh, too many Christians, not enough lions. And that made me really mad. So an atheist inspired the book So Many Lions, so few Daniels, which is what we’ve got. We’re living in a dark time, a time of tremendous godliness, or godlessness, should I say, tremendous darkness. I was just reading this morning, we’ve had something like 37 mass shootings in the us, just this sheriffs, not even the end of the first month of the share.
(03:40):
Um, over 1300 people died through being shot in mass shootings. And it traces it back to traces itself, back to lawlessness. Uh, Jesus said, inequity shall unbound, which means lawlessness. There’s a forsaking of the 10 Commandments. And when you do that, forsake the fear of God. And if you don’t fear God, you can cover what you want, lie to whom you want, steal from whom you want. You can commit adultery, you can blaspheme God’s name, and you can kill people without qualms of conscience because your understanding of God is erroneous. So we need Daniels, uh, men and women of God who will step up to the plate, who will not who’ll be fearless and faithful. You think of what Daniel was. He was a man that didn’t care what the world thought. He wasn’t a man pleaser. Uh, they said, don’t praise flung as windows open, the Bible tells us and said, I don’t care what you think.
(04:30):
I only care what God thinks. And that’s the attitude that we must have as Christians. We don’t care what this world thinks in the sense we don’t want their praise. We want the smile of God. And if you look at what Daniel had, he had faith. That’s all he had. And I take great consolation on the fact that I am not tall. I can’t sing. I can’t dance. Um, there’s a lot of stuff that I was behind the door when the talent was given out, but I can have faith. Anyone can have faith. Doesn’t matter how tall or short you are at gifted, you are how you can jump, how much you can sing. You can have faith, and that’s what Daniel had. And that’s all it takes for God to use. You just trust him with all your heart. And that’s what we need Daniels to step up and be counted.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (05:11):
Well, since my first name is Daniel, I must say I give a hardy endorsement to this book. I think we do need more Daniels. And, uh, of course, growing up as a little boy, Daniel was always my hero, uh, being thrown into the lion’s den. And often when you go out and talk to people about Jesus, it feels like you are being thrown into a lion’s den because the people start to yell at you, cuss you out. They they have all these questions, and that’s something that you do on a regular basis. And so I was wondering if we could walk through a few scenarios of what you say to people when you’re out witnessing. And you have lots of these in the book, different interviews you have with people. But uh, let’s say you’re, you go out on the street in Huntington Beach and you meet a guy who, he’s got tattoos all over. He having a party, he wants to party, he’s got a, a beer in one hand, and he is cussing people out. What do you say to him about God?
Ray Comfort (06:16):
You know, I’m gonna share something with you. I’ve never shared with anyone because it just happened this morning. This morning. My daughter and a husband, Emils Wayne Ey, the president of our ministry were woken at 5:00 AM by a guy ringing the doorbell. He wearing a hoodie, was dark, then he came round to the window of their bedroom and just stood there. And my daughter was terrified. Her daughter was terrified, easy flung up in the window and says, what do you want? And you know what, it was a guy who had smelt smoke coming from their house. Their wiring had got something wrong with it, and he came and put that fire out. And so if, if someone wakes you at five o’clock in the morning, you’re gonna be kind of annoyed with them and till you smell the smoke, and suddenly that annoyance turns to absolute gratitude.
(07:04):
This guy became a hero. And so this morning, when I go around the local college, which I do twice a day, take my dog on a bike, I’m gonna say to someone, how would you feel if someone woke you up at five o’clock in the morning banging on your doorbell? You’d say, what, what? What does this guy want? He’s really annoying me. But when you smell the smoke, your annoyance will change to gratitude. So I’m gonna take you through the commandments and what’s gonna happen is you’re gonna be annoyed with me banging on your door. But as we go through, you’re gonna smell some smoke and it’s gonna change your attitude. And so when I meet someone with tattoos or somebody who’s a little scary, my agenda is to show him he’s in great danger. It’s not to convince him to give his heart to Jesus because he’s got something missing in his life. The fact is he is in danger of death seizing upon him and his sins dragging him to hell. And that horrifies me. And I want to alert him to his danger. And once he sees his danger, once that makes sense, that he’s in big trouble with the Lord, then the gospel will make sense. So that’s my agenda, and that’s why I’m not fearful because the lions have no teeth. They’re just gums,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (08:07):
<laugh>. And, and so you would often go straight to the 10 Commandments and, and take people through some of the 10 Commandments. Could could we, uh, role play and, and and, and talk through the, the way that you would
Ray Comfort (08:20):
Offer it? Sure. I’ve done this before with some other guy I used to do a television program with, so I can handle it.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (08:26):
<laugh>. Okay. So, so come up and, and, and pretend like you’re talking to me and, and, uh, let’s, let’s go through what you often say about the 10 Commandments.
Ray Comfort (08:36):
Yeah, sure. Well, let’s do, uh, what I’ll do, what I’m, uh, what I do when I go to the, the local college, say, uh, Hey, would you like to go on YouTube?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (08:43):
Sure, let’s do it.
Ray Comfort (08:45):
Boy, that’s unusual. Most people say, what’s it about? What’s it about? So I say, it’s a channel over 200 million views. And, uh, I wanna ask you if you think there’s an afterlife, do you think there’s an afterlife?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (08:55):
Maybe? I don’t know. Who knows? I, I believe there’s an afterlife, but I I wanna play the part of the person that you’re witnessing.
Ray Comfort (09:02):
Yeah. You play the part of a nasty skeptic.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:04):
Yeah. So
Ray Comfort (09:05):
Do you think about it much? What, what, so let me ask you, what’s your name?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:08):
Uh, my name’s Daniel.
Ray Comfort (09:10):
Daniel. Do you think about death?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:12):
Well, I think everyone thinks about death.
Ray Comfort (09:15):
Are you afraid of dying?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:16):
Sure. I think everyone is.
Ray Comfort (09:19):
Yeah, that’s true. The bible actually says that, that every human being is haunted by the fear of death all their lifetime. And that, that, that’s a terrifying thing to think that death is gonna take you and take your loved ones, take a dog, take your grandma, and eventually take you. And it could even come today or tonight. Did you know the Bible tells us that God destroyed death? Did you know that?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:39):
Well, what, what if I don’t believe in the Bible?
Ray Comfort (09:43):
Well, that doesn’t matter. The Bible’s the worst world’s big, biggest selling book of all time. And it’s popular because it answers the great questions that humanity has. It tells us why we are alive, why we die, and what we can do about our biggest problem, death itself. Do you know what death is caused by? I don’t mean hit by a truck, but you dunno what the Bible says. Death actually is.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (10:04):
What? What is death?
Ray Comfort (10:05):
Death is wages. God is paying you in death for your sins. The Bible says the wages of sinners death. Like a judge looks at a criminal that’s murdered multiple people. He says, you’ve earned the death sentence. This is your wages. This is what’s due to you. And Daniel’s sin is so serious in the eyes of a holy God, it’s not in our eyes, but in God’s eyes, it’s so serious. He’s given you the death sentence. The wages of sinner’s death. And your death will be, the ev will be evidence to you that God is deadly serious about sin. I got a question for you. For you, Daniel, do you think God is justified in giving you a death sentence? Are you that evil or do you think you’re a good person? Well,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (10:40):
You know, I don’t really sin that much. I mean, I’m a pretty good person. I I do what’s good. I, I’d like to, you,
Ray Comfort (10:47):
You said sin that much. What are you talking about? What, what much? You’re talking about you’re lusting after woman looking at pornography. Is that what you mean?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (10:54):
Well, um, I don’t wanna answer that question.
Ray Comfort (10:57):
<laugh>. So you’re gonna play the fifth. What does that say?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:01):
<laugh> Uhhuh. <affirmative>.
Ray Comfort (11:01):
Yeah. Yeah. Jesus said if you look at a woman in lust for who you commit adultery with her in your hearts. So obviously you’ve got red blood and your veins, and you do what every guy does and look at woman inappropriately. Well, the Bible says you committed adultery when you do that. Yeah. And so we’re beginning to smell the smoke. You know, I’m knocking on your door, making you feel uncomfortable, but the smoke is appearing. Have you lied and stolen?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:23):
Well, I, I mean, maybe a little white lie from time to time.
Ray Comfort (11:27):
What color was it?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:28):
Uh, oh. You know, a white lie. Not, not a serious lie. Just, just a little lie.
Ray Comfort (11:33):
That’s a little lie. Have you ever stolen something, something a little and white?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:36):
Uh, sure. I mean, you know, uh, I stole a pen at, at school one time from, from one of my friends.
Ray Comfort (11:43):
Yeah. The value of that which is steal is irrelevant. If you open my wallet and take $1 out, you’re as much a thief as if you took $15 out. And so, Daniel, oh, have you ever used God’s name in vain?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:55):
Well, beepity beep beep beep. <laugh> <laugh>.
Ray Comfort (12:00):
Do you know, you just confirmed the truth of the Bible when it says you’re an enemy of God in your mind, through wicked works, there’s no greater contempt you can show of someone than to use their name as a cuss word. And that’s what you’ve done on the name of God, the one that gave you life in a family and eyesight and hearing and all the blessings of this life. So here’s a summation. Let’s ever again smell the smoke. Daniel, you have told me you’re relying thieving blas, adult at heart, and you have to face God on judgment day. Are you gonna be innocent or guilty when he judges you by the commandments?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (12:31):
Well, I guess anyone who is judged by the commandments would say that they’re guilty,
Ray Comfort (12:38):
Are you going to heaven or hell?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (12:41):
Well, if you’re guilty, I guess God would send you to hell.
Ray Comfort (12:44):
Yeah. So we can smell the smoke. So I’m not your adversary banging on your door. I’m someone that cares about you and wants to see you save. The Bible actually likens what I’m doing to saving someone from fire. It says in the book of Jo, uh, Jude, others save with fear, pulling them, pulling them from the fire. You are so close to death in hell. And I’m trying to pull you to safety now. And then I preach the cross that Christ died for our sins, took the punishment for us, rose again on the third day. And I say, Daniel, you need to repent. Trust Christ cuz you can die tonight. And so often people say, yeah man, this is making me think.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (13:22):
Yeah, it’s, it’s so powerful. And especially I love appreciate the cross. Uh, that’s the, the, the core of the gospel message. Let let’s do a, a another scenario. Um, what would you say to atheists if you meet a a a girl who, uh, says that she’s an atheist, she doesn’t believe in God. And, uh, atheists actually have a nickname for you. They affectionately call you the, the banana man because of a, I don’t know
Ray Comfort (13:48):
If it’s affectionately <laugh>, they mockingly
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (13:51):
Mockingly and uh, you know, from an illustration that you gave, uh, about a banana. And so they’ve, uh, made fun of you for that. But it’s opened the door for you to share the gospel with many atheists. And, and so what are some of the things that you say to atheists to make them think about heaven and hell and about whether there really is a God?
Ray Comfort (14:13):
Well, there’s a very, very simple way to make atheist s backslide. You just have to ask this one question, and you have to be very clear what you mean by it. I say, so Frieda, you’re an atheist. She says, yeah. So tell me this, Frieda, do you really believe the, the scientific impossibility that nothing created everything, because that’s what an atheist defaults to it. Either God created everything or nothing, created everything. I’m not saying you believe there was nothing in the beginning. I’m saying you believe that nothing was the force that created flowers and birds and trees and puppies and kittens and seasons and fruits and all these things that we see around us were all created nothing, which is scientifically ludicrous. Is that what you believe? And she’ll say, well, well, I I really, I I don’t believe that nothing created things. So I’ll say, you’re not an atheist.
(15:02):
You’re an agnostic. You think something created everything just wasn’t the God of the Bible. She says, yeah, that’s what I believe. Something did create everything, but it just wasn’t the God of the Bible. So I said, let’s see if we can find out why you don’t want it to be the God of the Bible. And you find out that she’s living in fornication and lying and stealing and blaspheming. And it’s not an intellectual issue, it’s the moral issue. But it’s so important Daniel not to be condescending and, uh, to have a tone where, where your love is evident for this person. And your concern is evident because many years ago I was woken by a friend. The building that, that our ministry was in was, uh, on fire. And he called me at 6:00 AM woke me and said, Ray, the Regent Theater building’s on fire. And I believed because of his tone, because of the, the, the way he told me that it was on fire. And if we want sinners to believe us, we must have a caring tone. We mustn’t be cond or accusatory, but just say, Hey, I love you. I don’t want you to end up and help. Please think about what we’re talking about.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (16:05):
How do you show love to people as you’re, as you’re talking to them about God? Because sometimes there’s this perception of an evangelist being out there on the street corner with a megaphone just yelling at people and saying, you’re all going to hell. And it tends to turn people off. They, they stand, they mock it. And and I know if you’ve been mocked many times and confronted every different situation, but how do you turn that from, uh, machi to people understanding you’re really concerned for their eternal destiny?
Ray Comfort (16:41):
Yeah. Uh, I, i amate Jesus, uh, when he spoke to the Rich Un ruler, he used the moral law, the 10 Commandments. 10 commandments called the Moral Law. He used the 10 Commandments bring the knowledge of sin. When you do that, it makes hell reasonable. Remember, Paul preached to Felix and the Bible says he reasoned with him of righteousness, temperance, and judgment to come. And Felix trembled, he trembled. Why? Because judgment made sense. So if you just yell at people from a distance and just say, you’re gonna hell, it doesn’t make sense. It’s just horrible. But if you open up those commandments and show sin is exceedingly sinful in the eyes of God, suddenly hell becomes reasonable. But that makes them tremble. That’s when they see your motives as motive is one of deep concern. You’re knocking on the door because the house is on fire.
(17:32):
And then that’s when they see that you really do care about them. And that’s when the gospel makes sense. So often, I, well not often, every time I witnesses someone, I give them a couple of $5, uh, gift cards. That is, that gives me great joy. Um, today I’ll go around and probably I’ll find five or I’m gonna sneeze. Please forgive me. No, I’m not. Five or six people will turn me down. Um, when I ask if they’ll come on camera and say, I’ll give you a couple of, uh, $5 in and out cards, which is the, the neatest, uh, burger place in Southern California. And they say, no, I still wanna do it. So that’s when I say, here’s the cards anyway. And they go, what? I didn’t do the interview. I said, no problem. I just really care about you. And I give ’em a little card with the channel and people just yell out, I’m gonna check your channel. I really am. Thank you so much for the cards. It changes everything. And the scripture says, so is the will of God that by your well, well-doing, you put the silence, the ignorance of foolish men. So it’s really good to have gift cards or something you can give to someone just to show that you are not caring about them just with lip surface. You really do care about them from your heart.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (18:41):
And your ministry has a lot of resources that people are able to, to give away. Uh, yesterday my son was enamored with your $1 million bill. And, uh, I was going to hold it up, but he took it to school this morning to go show some other boys the million dollar bill. And so your ministry, uh, living Waters has some, some great resources for people to, to give away to people different, uh, uh, ways to catch their attention and illusions and, and, and different little ways to, to present the gospel. They all bring people, uh, to the 10 Commandments. Um, I I have a couple of of tough questions about how you witnessed w would it be okay if I ask these these questions to you?
Ray Comfort (19:24):
Please do
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (19:25):
So, I’m an evangelist. I felt ever since I was very young that I was called to be an an evangelist. And so I’ve, I’ve, uh, spent my life telling as many people about Jesus as I can and studying evangelism and trying to become a, a, a better evangelist. And, and I have some challenges with the way that you start and some challenges with the way that you finish your conversations, right? And so, like the way that you, you start, you really emphasize the sinfulness of humanity instead of talking about the love of God. Bill Bright, who founded Campus Crusade for Christ, he often taught people to witness using the four spiritual laws. And he would start out by saying, “God loves you and he has a wonderful plan for your life.” And Romans 2:4 says, “it’s the goodness of God that draws men to repentance.” And just talked about the power of, of giving something to someone. And, and so, uh, you know, I I think it it in my theology, I I think in some ways it’s better to start with the goodness of God, the love of God, God’s the love the world that He gave his only son in, instead of focusing on the convincing people that they are sinners. And, and so what I I what what’s your response to, to those challenges?
Ray Comfort (20:52):
Okay, don’t let me forget Roman’s chapter two. Are these your convictions or are they just what you’ve heard?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (20:58):
Usually when I talk to people about Jesus, I start with, “Jesus is so good. He came to give us life and life more abundantly. He’s got a wonderful plan for your life. I I think people inherently believe that they’re sinners.
Ray Comfort (21:18):
Okay, let’s stop there so I can pick up what you’re saying cuz it’s so good. Yeah. Firstly, the Bible says there is none that understands. There’s none that sticks after God. It’s very important to imitate Jesus and do what Jesus did. And so whenever you see Jesus witnessing to someone who’s proud, arrogant, self-righteous, he always used the moral law to bring the knowledge of sin. And if it was someone who was humble of heart, like Nicodemus, who was a Jew that knew the law, it would give them grace. It’s very similar to a man who’s got a disease that’s gonna kill him, but he thinks he’s healthy. I would be an unwise doctor to give him the cure first because he’s not gonna appreciate and appropriate the the cure. He’s gonna say, I’m healthy. I don’t need your stupid cure. A wise doctor will show him x-rays. He’ll say, look at these x-rays, this poisonous seeping through your body. He wants to make the patient sweat to be concerned that his life is in danger. And when he says, well, what should I do? That’s when he gives him the cure. If he gives him the cure first, he is not gonna appreciate it nor appropriate it. And let’s go to the wonderful plan.
(22:27):
If you really think being a Christian is a wonderful plan, lean down to Stephen as he’s being stoned to death and say, part of God’s wonderful plan, or James, as his head is cut off with a sword, or Paul as he was beaten in stoned for his faith or the 12 apostles, 11 of which were murdered for their faith. Or read Fox’s book of martyrs and see that the wonderful plan isn’t things go better with Jesus. Jesus doesn’t give happiness, he gives righteousness. That’s what sinners need. If you really think God is a wonderful plan, I’m gonna give you a scenario. You’re on the thousandth, sorry, the hundredth story of the World Trade Center, September the 10th, 2001, the night before the World Trade Center. And as you look at the vasia faces before you, you know that every one of them is gonna die horrific and horrific deaths.
(23:24):
Some are gonna be burned alive with jet fuel. Others are gonna jump a hundred stories onto the unforgiving sidewalks of New York. Others will follow the building and their bodies will be so crushed they won’t find evidence of them. What are you gonna say to these people? Folks, God has a wonderful plan for your wife. You can’t say that to people who are about to die. No. Instead you’d say, please listen to me. The Bible says this appointed man wants to die. And after this, the judgment. And if you die in your sins, God’s gonna judge you by the perfect law. The Bible says that in Romans two, verse 12 and James two verse 12. That means if you’ve lusted after a woman, you’ve committed adultery in your heart. If you’ve lied all lies of their part in the lake of fire, no thief, no bless fe no adult woman here at God’s kingdom, you’re in terrible trouble.
(24:18):
You’ll end up in Helen at agrees my heart. But God provided a savior rose again on the third day, repent and trust in him. And the Bible promises you’ll pass from death to life. So that’s what I would say to someone if I, that’s what I’d say to a group at the World Trade Center and all around us are people who could die today, 150,000 people die every 24 hours. They die in their sins. They’re going to hell. They could die in just a horrific circumstances of the World Trade Center burned alive in a car when they’re driving home or crushed under a truck or diet of a terrible terminal disease like cancer. And so I can’t talk to him of a wonderful wife, a wonderful plan that God has in fact, bill bright repented of that false gospel. And his manager wrote a forward to my book, called God is a Wonderful Plan for Your Life.
(25:08):
Which, so Stephen, being stoned to death. Yeah, that’s, I’ve got a copy of it right here. Okay. And, uh, so Romans chapter two, the goodness of God leads us to repentance. If Paul was saying in Romans two, the goodness of God leads to repentance of just talk about God’s goodness, he wasn’t practicing what he preached. Because if you read that in context, that verse is wrapped in terrible wraths. If you read in context where he says, God, if you, you know, if you continue and with an impenitent heart, God will give you tribulation and anguish upon every soul you are storing. Um, you know, you are storing up wrath that is gonna be revealed on the day of wrath. And so it’s very important that we don’t have our own way of witnessing, but we go and see what did Jesus do? Rich unruly came to him and says, what can I do to inherit eternal wife?
(26:01):
Jesus didn’t talk about a wonderful plan. He instead says, why do you call me good? And he reproved his understanding of the word good. And then he said, you know, the commandments. And then he went through the commandments with him. Why? To bring the knowledge of sin. He talked before about people know they’re sinners. The apostle Paul didn’t know he was a sinner. This is what he said, I had not known sin, but by the law. It’s not within man’s heart to understand how sinful is, how sinful sin is until the law brings the knowledge of sin. And so for 10 years, I preached God as a wonderful plan for your wife. And I filled the church with false converts. 90% under that erroneous message fall away from the faith 90%. If you were selling a parachute and you said, this parachute works only 10% of the time you need to get outta the parachute business.
(26:58):
You don’t want 90% of those jumped who jump, uh, die wearing your parachute. So it’s very important we say, what does scripture say? Let’s not have modern evangelism’s traditions. But let’s see what the Bible says about how to bring people to the cross. We’re not out to get decisions. We’re out to see men have a knowledge of sin and understand the gospel because that’s what a good soil under good soil here understands the true convert and the parable of the, so someone who’s hears and understands. And what the law does is the school master helps sinner understand the gospel. Is that making any sense or am I just raving on?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (27:33):
Well, in 2 Corinthians 3:7, Paul calls the 10 Commandments a ministry of death and condemnation. And I s right, actually, I, I wrote a book about, uh, the grace of God and, and I, I like looking at God, uh, through the eyes of grace. I think the, the Bible reveals a, a God that that is full of grace. And, and it, I usually emphasize, um, pointing people to Jesus. You know, uh, John 12:32, Jesus said, “If I be lifted up, I will draw all men onto me.” And so I think the more
Ray Comfort (28:07):
People, what’s the next verse about Jesus? What’s the next verse?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (28:10):
Tell me
Ray Comfort (28:12):
This. He said, speaking of what death he should die. So when he says, if I be lifted up, he wasn’t giving us an evangelist principle. He was saying what death? He was gonna die. He was gonna die by the cross. That’s the context. The other thing, the administration of the law is under death. That’s its function. That’s why Jesus used it. That’s why Paul used it. It shows us we have no hope in our attempt to attain righteousness. That only hope we have is the gospel. And then it says, we’re sin bound much more to grace abound. If you want make a light shine, put it in darkness. If you want calvary to shine, put it against Sinai. Show what sinner is and say, look what God did for us. Christ died for us, but while we yet sin us. So again, no one’s gonna appreciate a cure unless he understands he’s got the disease.
(29:01):
And if you circumnavigate talking about the disease, you’ll create false converts that’ll join the church and fall away at which 90% do. So it’s very important, Daniel, you go back to scripture and say, what does scripture say? The law brings death. That’s what Paul said. The law, which I thought was unto life, brought know the commandment, which I thought was the Dana unto life brought death to me. That’s his function. It shuts us up with no hope. But to look up to the cross, it’s like those biting serpents that have spoken off in the book of numbers that Jesus referred to in John chapter three. He said, as Moses lifted up the serpent on the wilderness, so must the son a man be lifted up. Go back. What happened? There were biting serpents that caused them to look up to that, that cross or that poll was being held up. And as the biting ser serpents of the law that bring death to us, that cause us to look to Jesus on the cross, cause us to have hope in him. So please think about this. Have you ever heard teaching called Hell’s Best Kept Secret?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (30:02):
Uh, yes, I’ve I’ve heard you teach on it. Um, live actually. And then I’ve got your, was this your first book that you wrote?
Ray Comfort (30:10):
No. No, it wasn’t. No, but it was one of the most important books. The first book was published in the us.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (30:16):
I mean, I think it’s one of your, your most significant messages that you’re well known for.
Ray Comfort (30:20):
Yeah. And have you read God as a wonderful plan for your life as yet?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (30:24):
Yes, sir. I’ve, I’ve read it.
Ray Comfort (30:26):
Okay. Really good. Yeah.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (30:27):
And, and, and, uh, you know, I I I think that it’s easier to draw people to God by talking about the goodness of God. Instead of talking, it’s unbiblical about the, the sinfulness of, of humanity. It’s not
Ray Comfort (30:39):
Biblical. It’s not biblical.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (30:41):
What, what, what do you,
Ray Comfort (30:41):
That’s what you need to look at. Is it biblical
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (30:43):
John 10:10 where Jesus said, I’ve come to give life and life more abundantly.
Ray Comfort (30:48):
Okay, let me address that, Paul, when he said, I’ve come to give life and life more abundantly, that word just means full. It doesn’t mean happy, it means full if possible. Paul had an abundant life. It was filled with beatings, stoning, shipwreck, imprisonment, and martyrdom. So that’s what he was saying. You read the book of Acts, they had a full abundant life. They were thrown in prison, they were tortured and 11 them died. So to say to people, God has a wonderful, happy life for you, it’s just gonna be a bed of roses without the thorns, is to create a wrong motive for people coming to Christ. And it, it’s filling the church with false converts. It’s not looking at what the scriptures say and what Jesus did and what Paul did. In Romans chapter two, Paul says, you who say you shall not steal, do you steal?
(31:36):
You say, you shall not commit adultery. Do you commit adultery? When Nathan stood before David, who had committed adultery and murder, he had violated the commandments. He didn’t talk about a wonderful plan. He said, why have you despised the commandment of the Lord? And so we need to, as I say, imitate scripture. Say, what did Jesus do? Cuz we don’t wanna be false witnesses. Say something that’s not true and fill the church with false converts because we are doing the work of the enemy rather than the work of God. And this is what I’ve been saying for 40 years, and people who have put into practice what Jesus did in, uh, mark 10 verse 17, and used the law to bring the knowledge of sin and forsaken the traditional way of evangelism, have found it to be biblical and and to be true, to open up sinner’s minds as to what we should do when it comes to challenging people to come to Christ.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (32:25):
I also wanted to talk to you a little bit about bringing people to a, a decision. Like when you were running through your scenario a little bit earlier, you, you said, why don’t you think about that? And you, you often finish by saying, why don’t you think about that? Instead of asking people to, to pray, uh, a a prayer of, of salvation, um, why don’t you ever close the deal? I mean, if, if I give you a scenario where, uh, somebody comes into a car lot and Ray the car salesman and is there and says, oh, you have such an ugly car, your windows won’t roll down, your air conditioner doesn’t work. And look, you’ve got a big scrape on the side of your car. If the salesman doesn’t ever actually help them get into a new car, the salesman wouldn’t be a a very good salesman.
(33:16):
He would just leave them going around feeling very bad that they have an ugly car. But a good salesman will put them into a brand new car, upgraded all the features and options and everything. And so it, it seems to me that in some ways that, uh, you don’t close the deal. Why don’t you bring people to a point of decision? And, and I think it is very biblical to bring people to a point of decision in, in Deuteronomy, you know, uh, Moses says, I set before you life and death, blessing and cursing, therefore choose life. He’s encouraging them to choose to follow God, to choose a way of life. And so in your, in your witness, then why don’t you bring people to a point of, of choosing whether they’ll, they’ll follow Jesus.
Ray Comfort (34:06):
That’s what I do. But I don’t choose for them. I know you see, your, your methodology will be dictated by your theology. If you have a wrong theology about God and salvation, you’ll think that you bring people to salvation. When the Bible says salvation of the Lord, there’s nothing in the Bible that condones the modern sinner’s prayer where I say to someone, pray after me. Uh, dear God, I’m a sinner. That’s like saying to someone who’s committed, adultry, honor’s wife. Let’s go back to your wife. Knock on the door, door opens and say, okay, I want you to apologize to your wife. Repeat an apology after me. Dear wife, I’m really sorry. Dear wife, I’m really sorry I committed adultery. Please forgive me. That’s crazy. The sorrow should come from his heart and it should not be his words, it should come from his heart.
(34:54):
I see no evidence anywhere in scripture of anyone praying a sinner’s prayer, a prayer like that. And so I don’t imitate it. I say, Lord, you save sinners. I don’t save sinners. I share the gospel with them and I’ll leave it between them and God. And I’m not gonna manipulate them through any psychological manipulation or clever wording. I’m not a car salesman. I’m not selling cars. I wanna be a true and faithful witness and see people soundly saved and not produced false converts like I used to do when I ran around praying the sinner’s prayer of my surfing buddies. Does that make sense?
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (35:30):
Absolutely. I I I very much appreciate your time. Um, if you’re listening, I really encourage you to get a of the new book, so Many Lions, so Few Daniels, it’s a great book, um, brother Comfort. If someone wants to know more about your ministry, uh, how can they find out more about you? What’s your website?
Ray Comfort (35:50):
Living waters.com. And they can go to YouTube and watch, um, uh, YouTube videos. And, uh, it’s, uh, um, a lot of stuff on Living waters.com free. We’re giving away 5 million of this gospel track, free of charge and, uh, no shipping charge. We’re, we’re paying for the shipping and giving away the tracks free. And they can see about that on our Living waters.com.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (36:13):
Well, thank you so much. You know, despite some of maybe our theological differences, I have tremendous respect for your ministry. I
Ray Comfort (36:23):
Don’t know why, because you think I’m doing it wrong. You shouldn’t have respect for me. You shouldn’t promote my books or the website because I’m doing it unbiblically.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (36:32):
I’m, I am for anybody that goes out there and talks to people about Jesus. And, and so I very much honor you and the many people that, that you have, uh, got to think about the the things of God. Um, I I do have one more question. The name of your TV show is The Way of the Master. When Jesus walked on the Earth, his way was to heal lots of sick people. And so I come from a, a spirit empowered background. Often in our services, we’ll pray for sick people to be healed. And, and often people’s, many people say that they, they receive healing. If you really want to follow the way of the master do you think that God will heal people as a way to bring people to Jesus?
Ray Comfort (37:24):
Of course, I pray for people that are sick, <laugh>, obviously. Um, but the way of the master is called the way of the master because it’s what Jesus did with the rich young ruler. He used the commandments to bring the knowledge of sin. He didn’t pray for his sickness or bring up sickness. He brought a knowledge of sin using those 10 commandments so that he would understand his sinfulness, that he had violated God’s law. So that’s what I do. Jesus said, go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. Paul says in Romans 1:16, the gospel is the power of God to salvation. And so you can pray for sick people, that’s great, but they must hear the gospel because without the knowledge of sin, there’s no understanding of the cross, there’s no understanding of the cross, there’s no salvation. So make sure that you don’t just pray for someone so saw wrist or whatever, or a headache or whatever, that you give them the gospel and the biblical gospel, not the erroneous gospel of God as a wonderful plan for your life, cuz that has done great damage to the cause of the gospel and filled the church with false converts.
(38:29):
So anyway, I’ve gotta go. I’ve got a gospel to preach. It’s close to 11, and I’m gonna go around to the school and a local college and witness to people who are going to hell. And that grieves my heart.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (38:41):
That’s wonderful. Well, thank you so much for being on the Evangelism podcast. I really appreciate it.
Evangelism Podcast Host (38:47):
Is there evidence for God’s existence? How do we really know Jesus was raised from the dead? Can we trust the Bible? Do miracles happen? Does God care about me as an individual? In Dr. Daniel King’s book, proof God is real. You’ll find the answers to these three vital questions and more Is God there? Does God care? And do I dare to follow him? In his powerful, easy to read book, Daniel provides seven convincing proofs of God’s existence. You’ll learn about the evidence of cause. Design, logic, morality, scripture, miracles, and religious experience with proof God is real. You’ll read about topics like, was Jesus the son of God or just a crazy preacher? If God does exist, is he interested in your life? If God is there, why do bad things happen to good people? Proof God is real. Daniel King shows you God is there and he cares for you. Plus how to take a leap of faith and start a relationship with a God who deeply loves you. Order proof God is real today by calling 1-877-431-FOUR 2 7 6 or find the book on Amazon.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (39:50):
Thanks so much for listening today. I am excited about telling people about Jesus and I want to invite you to be a part of helping us to rescue people from Hell and take them with us to heaven. There’s two things you can do to help. First of all, can you go find the Evangelism podcast on Apple iTunes and leave us a positive review by giving a review, you will help other people find these valuable resources about sharing our faith. And second, would you become a financial partner with King Ministries? Every single dollar that people give us enables us to lead at least one person to Jesus. And so that means for only $1, you can help start a party in heaven. And so today I want to invite you to become a monthly partner. You can start out for just a dollar, but if God puts on your heart to do more, of course you can do more. But please go to king ministries.com and become a monthly partner with us today to help us to lead more people to Jesus. Thank you so much and God bless you.
Evangelism Podcast Host (41:10):
For more information about how to share your faith or to financially support our worldwide evangelistic outreaches, visit king ministries.com. Again, that’s king ministries.com.
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Ben King | The Circuit Riders Come to Tulsa
The original circuit riders were Methodist preachers who rode on horses from town to town to preach the Gospel. Today, there is a new generation of Circuit Riders who are dedicated to serving Jesus. They are part of Youth With A Mission (YWAM) and they are bringing a big team to Tulsa, OK to tell people about Jesus. Today we talk with Ben King about what they hope to see God do in T-Town.
Find Out More About the Circuit Riders: https://circuitriders.com/
Transcript:
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
The original circuit writers were Methodist preachers who rode on horses from town to town to preach the gospel. Today, there is a new generation of circuit writers who are dedicated to serving Jesus. They are part of youth with a mission, and they’re bringing a big team to Tulsa, Oklahoma, to tell people about Jesus. Today we talk with Ben King about what they hope to see God do in T-Town.
Evangelism Podcast Host (00:37):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast with Dr. Daniel King, where Daniel interviews full-time evangelists, pastors, missionaries, and normal everyday Christians to discover how they share their faith, their powerful testimonies, and amazing stories that will inspire you to reach people with the good news. And now here’s your host, missionary, and evangelist Daniel King.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:02):
Welcome to the Evangelism Podcast. I’m Daniel King, and I’m excited about telling people about Jesus. Today. I have a very special guest with me, Ben King. Thank you so much for being on the Evangelism Podcast.
Ben King (01:13):
Excited to be here. Um, yeah, so, uh, excited just to talk about evangelism and got to hear a little bit of your heart and what you’re doing. So, um, yeah, just honored to be here and you led so many people to Jesus. So I think it’s just, um, awesome to talk about Jesus meeting our generation with the gospel and so
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:30):
Love it. Amen. So, Ben King is with the Circuit Writers, which is a YWAM ministry that is passionately following after Jesus Christ and calling other people to follow Jesus Christ. Now, the name circuit writers goes back to some of the original preachers here in America. Ben, tell me who were the circuit writers?
Ben King (01:54):
Yeah, so the circuit writers were kind of these radical, uh, missionaries, uh, of evangelists. Um, they were kind of these zealous group of young people that came. Most of ’em came over from the uk. Some of the original preachers like John Wesley & Francis Asbury was actually commissioned here by John Wesley. And, uh, they were really known for their zeal for the gospel. And then the Frontiers of America, what would happen is they would ride around largely on horseback from town to town. And, uh, the history books tell us that they would ride through towns and they would basically shout things to the whole town, like 6:00 PM we’re meeting at the courthouse or wherever they chose to meet. They would pick up public common area and ride through town, say, Hey, we’re meeting here. And then they would just stand up and boldly proclaim the gospel, call people to be saved.
(02:44):
Um, the testimonies are that as, um, well, Asbury Wesley was doing this in England for a number of years, and at one point in one of his meetings, he, uh, he said, who will go to the Frontiers of America? And this young man named Francis Asbury, uh, answered the, came to America and he started training preachers in America. He actually came, uh, during the Revolutionary War at first. So he, uh, he came and many people when he first came to America were like, this guy’s a spy. Like, so his first year in America, he had to hide. They said he would hide in this little room. And, uh, and then after the Revolutionary War started preaching and raising up preachers, I think he, uh, the history tells us that he personally, um, commissioned and trained about 700 preachers to do what he did. And they would all ride, all of these preachers would ride from town to town, preach the gospel. Um, they saw movement all across America, thousands getting saved, coming into the church, and then planting churches as well. And so, uh, really was this inspirational movement of mostly young preachers. Actually most of them, uh, traveled so intensely that they died by the age of, uh, 33. So Francis Asbury specifically, he wrote an average of 6,000 miles a year. And, uh, he would preach everywhere it says courthouses, public houses, tobacco houses, fields, public squares, wherever people would assemble to heal. To hear him, it said, uh, that he would preach. And, um,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (04:10):
I think it’s really incredible neat to hear the story of Francis Asbury because just in the last few weeks there have been reports of revival happening Yes. At Asbury University. Yes. Which is named after this great preacher Francis Asbury. And, and so as you mentioned, he rode over 6,000 miles every year that wasn’t riding in a car or on a plane that was a horseback. On a horseback. And he would have his Bible in one hand. He’d have his theological book in the other he’d be writing Yeah. And studying. And then he’d get to a town, he’d call all the people together, he would minister to them, plant a church in that area, and, and then he would do a circuit. He would come back and, and, and, uh, he would go to the next town, plant another church, and, and tell he had a bunch of churches going.
(05:00):
Then he’d go in this circuit writing from, from church to church. Yes. And so over the course of his lifetime, it’s estimated that Asbury traveled over 300,000 miles and we have his journals. So he delivered over 16,500 sermons. And so they called him, uh, you know, they called, uh, the Apostle John, uh, camel knees cuz his, he prayed so much. Yeah. I think we should call Asbury Camel Butt because by the time he <laugh> traveled all that way on his, on horseback, he probably had some serious callouses. So, uh, by when, when Asbury arrived in America, there were 600 Methodists in the entire country. Yes. And by the time he died, there were over 214,000 members. Incredible. Incredible. From 600 to 214,000, one of the greatest revivals in history. And I, the question that our generation is crying out and asking God is, can something like this happen again?
Ben King (06:05):
Yeah, I mean, I think absolutely. I think we’re seeing it at Asbury College. You know, and this is a continuation of Francis Asbury’s legacy in many ways. Um, and you know, the Hunger, they had about 20,000 people. The city shut down, the city’s made for I think, uh, maximum of like 10,000. And so, um, definitely Gen Z is hungry for this kind of movement and revival and this experience of the gospel where people are getting saved, miracles are breaking out. Um, so I would say absolutely yes. And, uh, and not just on the Christian campuses like Asbury, but we’ve been traveling to secular campuses and we find the same hunger on the secular campuses where people are wanting the gospel. So.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (06:46):
And so you are with Circuit writers, it’s a ministry that is part of ywam, but you have hundreds of young people that are joining. Tell me, what does circuit writers do?
Ben King (07:01):
Yeah, so we’re, uh, we’re based outta Huntington Beach, California. Um, we started in 2011, really inspired by these, uh, early circuit writer preachers like John Wesley Asbury. Um, and so we travel to, uh, college campuses and high school campuses, but we also do inner city events. Um, really our, our heart is just to preach the gospel and, uh, really anywhere people would hear us, just like the early, uh, circuit riders. And so we, uh, yeah, I’m actually in the middle of a tour right now, going to, uh, secular campuses and posting up in the student union gathering students and just preaching the gospel. Um, but yeah, circuit Riders is primarily to reach, uh, our generation with the gospel. Um, and we’re focusing on college and high school campuses, but not limited to that. But
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (07:44):
Yeah. And so you’ve come here to Tulsa, Oklahoma, which is why you’re with me today. And you are planning an outreach here in Tulsa? Yes, and so we were just had a meeting where we’re talking about several different outreaches that are going to take place. Uh, we’re going to go partner with, uh, teen Challenge and, and bridging hunger and, and give away food in one neighborhood. And the circuit writers are gonna come and help us out with that. And then, uh, some of my interns are planning another outreach that they’re calling, uh, glow for Jesus, and they’re going to take some glow sticks and going downtown Tulsa and we’re gonna pass out the glow sticks and talk to all the people in downtown Tulsa around all the bars on a Friday night. Uh, we fe and I’m just excited that circuit writers is coming here because Tulsa still has a lot of people that need Jesus. Even though that we have great ministries here and great churches, there’s still people right here in Tulsa that need Jesus and Yeah. And this is all over America.
Ben King (08:43):
Yeah, I, I mean, I think the greatest misconception is as I’ve gone to, you know, we’ve been going to a lot of campuses in the Bible Belt and in the southern states of America. And I find that a lot of Christians in these places are blind to the reality of the need cuz they kind of have this assumption. Uh, most people around me are Christian. And I find as we go out and do evangelism in all of these places, that many people are waiting to hear the gospel. And, and actually there are people all throughout the south who have never heard the gospel. And so I think even in a place like Tulsa, like, um, you know, we met a young man a couple days ago who was, uh, he was, uh, involved in a gang. He was in drugs. And as I shared the gospel with him, he said, I’ve never heard Jesus talked about and forgiveness and the blood of Jesus talked about in this way. And he ended up giving his life to Christ and getting saved. And we pray for him to be filled with the Holy Spirit. So I think a hundred percent there’s need all around us. Um, and I think as Christians, we have to, even in America wake up to that need and be aware of our calling to evangelism and to share the gospel in these places to these people. So,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:46):
So let’s talk a little bit about the circuit writers. How do people join? How do they become a part? And then what are some of the core beliefs in the culture that you try to create in circuit writers?
Ben King (10:00):
Yeah, so, uh, we run schools every year, kind of similar to ywam, uh, discipleship Training School. It’s called a DTS Discipleship Training School. And, uh, they’re either, uh, they’re about seven to eight months long and you go through three months of training and then you go out and actually share the gospel. So it’s a very, uh, empowering model where we’re really believing our generation, um, is called to evangelism. So it’s mostly focused on, um, you know, our Gen Z Age group. Um, and, uh, we, yeah, so we invite people to our schools. So that’s one way to, you can join, you can just go to circuit writers.com, apply for one of our schools, and there’s more information about all that there. Um, but really our heart is, um, yeah, to see people come to Christ. So one of the primary things we’ve been realizing this year is that, uh, we want to, uh, share the gospel across college campuses and, and high schools in the cities, but also equip a generation to carry the gospel. Um, and I think, so evangelism is kind of at the core of what we do. Um, acts of service in the city, some of our core cultures, like our founder, uh, his name is Brian Brent and he passed away in 2000, uh, about it two years ago now. So yeah, I
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (11:09):
Never got to meet him, but I’ve heard such amazing things Yes. About Brian. And it was really sad when he went to heaven. Yeah. So
Ben King (11:15):
I was actually here in Tulsa when he passed. Um, we were doing an event at O R U, um, but just, he was incredible man of humility. I think some of the things that we would always say about Brian is like, he was such a, he was so happy I got to live with him for a couple months and with his family, he was so happy and lighthearted and joyful. But at the same time, Carrie, this just this edge of conviction, um, and the fear of the Lord. And, and, you know, so he, he wrote these manuals called the Freedom Manual, the Cultureship Manual, which kind of lists out the core cultures that we, uh, carry in circuit writers. One of them is like the culture of the Radical Servant, where Brian would, uh, just teach the, like the, the core goal in Christianity is to lay your life down and serve other people.
(11:57):
It’s not to, you know, make your name great or get a title or even to do something massively impactful, but it is to lay your life down and radically serve others. Um, and just he would talk about the joy of that. You know, he made up a song called Radical Servant that he’s sang in a sermon and we all started singing it. And um, so, um, and so, so many of these cultures in these manuals, which you can also buy online on our website, um, were just, they kind of set the foundation for what we carry as a movement. And, um, really for me as a young man getting saved at 17, joining the movement when I was 18, I’m 25 now. Um, some of the things that Brian would, would lead and teach, um, for me were so, uh, culture shifting and foundational even in my early Christian walk.
(12:41):
So, um, Brian definitely, you know, a lot of these things, obviously Brian led by the Holy Spirit. A lot of these cultures can be largely accredited to what he carried and steward even through, you know, his wife Christie. And, um, she’s still, you know, doing lots of ministry. But, um, yeah, so, uh, it’s definitely been since his past, it’s been different in our ministry. But definitely seeing the, his legacy walked out through all of the leaders that he raised up, cuz a foundation in RC Riders has been look for leaders, pour into the leaders and raise up the leaders and the places that we’re going to. So let’s
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (13:13):
Talk about evangelism and the circuit writer’s heart for evangelism. You’re starting to branch out and you just recently went to Burundi and you have a heart to go to other nations and you’d like to see a harvest of souls all over the world.
Ben King (13:29):
Yes. So we’re, uh, we’re just starting this. We’re calling it just carry the love festivals and um, you know, doing what you do in a much smaller way in the early beginnings. Um, but uh, cuz I know you’ve led millions to Jesus around the world and just have this incredible heart of love for Jesus. But, um, yeah, for us, we’re just, you know, group of, uh, 20 year olds and we’re, uh, really a believing God has led us in faith to do these festivals. We did the first one last year in Burundi, and it was a week long where we did most of the week, was training in evangelism and sending out the locals. So we trained about 700 local burundians and, um, here’s how you share the gospel and win souls and then bring people into the local church. And then we sent them out and, uh, in the week about five to, it was between five and 6,000 people gave their lives to Jesus.
(14:16):
Um, I just got a testimony actually of a young man who got trained in one of those trainings, uh, a couple months ago. Um, so this was, the event was about a year ago. A couple months ago, he went out and, uh, he left his city, went to a small town and began to preach the gospel. And he personally led 800 people to Jesus, a a young burundian man who came to one of our evangelism trainings and was inspired. So, um, our heart is to raise up the local evangelists and really do it together. Um, and so in Tulsa, uh, we’re planning that for April 21st, we’re doing a larger outdoor gathering and, uh, we’re looking at doing some, we’re in the downtown area, um, but we’re gonna do a week of outreach as you know, like you said, partnering with you guys, all these other ministries, um, to reach the loss. So, um, yeah, we’re doing eight, uh, different locations this year and just kind of, uh, you know, going after it in faith and we’ll see what happens. We’re really believing this year would be a spark of faith that we could continue in the years to come. Um, but there’s about five. What
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (15:12):
Are some of the other cities that you’re planning to go to this year?
Ben King (15:14):
So, uh, let me see if I can list them all. So we got Budapest, um, that, uh, my wife and I will go to, we’re doing, uh, uh, Louisiana, lsu, and then we’re doing, uh, Tijuana. Um, so, uh, I got about four, uh, we’re doing, uh, at, actually one of our core gatherings at Spark Circuit Riders was, um, at usc. And so we’re going back to usc. We’re doing a lawn in the middle of campus, so some of them are campuses and some of them are cities. And then, uh, we’re going back to Burundi again, um, for round two in Burundi, um, the uk. And then, uh, I think I covered all of ’em. I might have missed one.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (15:48):
Now, a big part of what you do is worship and in the circuit writers you actually have some really amazing worship leaders. Yes. Tell me about how worship and evangelism can work together.
Ben King (15:58):
Yeah, so, uh, o obviously we have Lindy in our movement who, uh, is incredibly well known and, and really a lot of her music was, uh, it was different because it had this edge of like, the great commission in it. So it was, uh, a lot of her songs were like, you know, every Nation, every Soul was one of her songs. And so, uh, it just kind of included this aspect of like, we need to go and share the gospel. Um, which has been massively inspirational to our, you know, really to the church and across the world. But she, uh, wrote these songs and, and so, uh, they really have this aspect of like, go, uh, and share the gospel, win the loss. And what we really believe in circuit Riders is, um, you know, wor the first time worship is mentioned in the Bible is it’s uh, when Abraham sacrifices his son Isaac.
(16:45):
Um, and so, uh, worship is obedience to God. And so I think, uh, obviously he singing songs, we’re gonna do that for eternity and it’s gonna be beautiful and amazing and it is now and we do that. Um, but one of the ways that we get to worship now, um, as well is our evangelism becomes an act of worship cuz it’s an expression of our love to Jesus. Um, and so I think combining, you know, the songs and the singing and the worship, this pure heart to Jesus with the proclamation of the gospel is perfect cuz it’s just a, it’s a continuation of like, Hey, we just worship for two hours now we’re gonna go out and find people that are lost and win them. It’s just a continuation of we’re expressing our love for Jesus through bold proclamation of the gospel and through singing songs. So, um, yeah, that’s what I would say.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (17:31):
I really love your heart for God. And you’re still young, but you are radically committed to following Jesus. What would you say to a young person who is looking for, for purpose and and looking for, for meaning? What would say to them to, to bring them closer to Jesus?
Ben King (17:53):
Yeah, I would just say run after Jesus with your whole heart. I mean, I was 17 when I got saved. I was addicted to drugs, alcohol, pornography. My whole life was a broken mess. I contemplated suicide, pack of cigarettes a day. One night I overdosed and a few nights later I came home and I prayed and there was this incredible, uh, sense of the presence of God that filled my room that night. I fell on my knees, began to weep, and, uh, three months later got baptized, totally set free from drugs, alcohol, pornography, all of those things. And so for seven years now, I’ve been walking in this incredible freedom where, um, and when I first got saved my, I just started going to like Walmart in these places and just telling people like Jesus, I didn’t even know the gospel. I was just like, Jesus loves you cuz I was so, my heart was so satisfied and in love with Jesus.
(18:37):
And so I think, uh, come into the presence of God. Uh, Christianity is not, uh, a religion per se. It’s a, it’s a heart that has drawn so near to God that it’s so deeply satisfied. There’s an overflow of love for other people from that place. So, um, yeah, I would just say by the, you know, come to Jesus and invite the Holy Spirit into your heart, into your mind, into your soul, into every area of your life and be fully satisfied. And from that place of deep satisfaction in your personal life, having found everything you need in Jesus alone, um, go out and tell others about him and, uh, you’ll, you’ll experience joy that you maybe, uh, having up to this point. Some of my greatest joy has been watching other people receive Christ just like I did when I was 17. So, yeah.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (19:26):
Well, Ben, you have a great last name. Your last name is Key. Yeah,
Ben King (19:30):
We have the same last name.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (19:31):
Maybe we’re related somewhere. I don’t know <laugh>, but it is a good last name. So it’s, uh, such an honor to have you on the Evangelism podcast. Thank you for being with me today.
Ben King (19:39):
Thanks so much for having me.
Evangelism Podcast Host (19:40):
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Evangelism Coach Daniel King (20:43):
Thanks so much for listening today. I am excited telling people about Jesus and I want to invite you to be a part of helping us to rescue people from Hell and take them with us to heaven. There’s two things you can do to help. First of all, can you go find the Evangelism podcast on Apple iTunes and leave us a positive review by giving a review, you will help other people find these valuable resources about sharing our faith. And second, would you become a financial partner with King Ministries? Every single dollar that people give us enables us to lead at least one person to Jesus. And so that means for only $1, you can help start a party in heaven. And so today I want to invite you to become a monthly partner. You can start out for just a dollar, but if God puts on your heart to do more, of course you can do more. But please go to king ministries.com and become a monthly partner with us today to help us to lead more people to Jesus. Thank you so much and God bless you.
Evangelism Podcast Host (22:04):
For more information about how to share your faith or to financially support our worldwide evangelistic outreaches, visit king ministries.com. Again, that’s king ministries.com.