Joel McGill has a vision to reach all of America for Jesus. All America is a ministry connected with Call2All, a global movement that has brought together over 60,000 leaders in strategic partnership to fulfill the Great Commission. They have put together a variety of resources designed to help communities across America to reach every person with the Gospel. Today, we talk about how to measure evangelistic success by using five finish lines and much more…
What are the finish lines?
- Pray for every person by name
- Connect with every person personally
- Connect every person with Jesus
- Connect every person with the Bible
- Connect every person with a Christian Community
Access the All America resources: https://allamerica.org/resources-3/
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (00:00):
Joel McGill has a vision to reach all of America for Jesus. All America is a ministry connected with Call2All, a global movement that has brought together over 60,000 leaders in strategic partnership to fulfill the great commission. They have put together a variety of resources designed to help communities across America, to reach every person with the gospel. Today, we talk about how to measure evangelistic success by using five finish lines. And we’re gonna talk about much, much more.
Evangelism Podcast Host (00:48):
Welcome to the evangelism podcast with Dr. Daniel King, where Daniel interviews, full-time evangelists, pastors, missionaries, and normal everyday Christians to discover how they share their faith, their powerful testimonies and amazing stories that will inspire you to reach people with the good news. And now here’s your host missionary and evangelist Daniel King.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:12):
Welcome to the evangelism podcast. I’m Daniel King, and I’m excited about telling people about Jesus today. I have a very special guest Joel McGill. He is with all America and their goal is to reach every person in America with the gospel. Joel is great to be with you today.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (01:30):
It’s great to be here with you too.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (01:31):
So all America is under the umbrella of Call2All, a ministry led by Mark Anderson. Right now we’re on the campus of YWAM in Kansas city, and this is where your office is. And you’ve been involved in helping to put together these strategies for reaching people all over America. And in other parts of the world, tell me a little bit about yourself and how you got started doing this.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (02:01):
Yeah, well, I’m originally from Chicago, so I’ve survived the streets of Chicago. So I guess I can survive anywhere. We have been my family and I’ve, we’ve been a part of youth of the mission since 2000. So 22 years now serving in Australia all throughout Asia and the us and Caribbean. So have been just trying to be faithful to just get the gospel to as many people as possible.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (02:24):
So tell me a little bit about the All America initiative. What is the goal and how are you going about accomplishing it?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (02:32):
So for the last 22 years, we’ve been focused very much on the frontiers on the unreached unengaged people, groups, and all those that have never heard. And along the way we have continually been talked about, of talked to about, about the idea of a national strategy. What does it look like to take? Not just a people group, but an entire nation and to get the gospel to everybody. And so the Lord in 2016 gave us a burden when we were very much focused on the rest of the world. And we’re very happy about all the amazing things that are going on. The Lord said America is a mission field and really redirected our efforts. And we had a lot of Jonah reluctant you know, missionaries saying, Hey, we wanna go work in all these other countries. And the Lord was saying, there’s a moment in time for America that we’re supposed to contend. And so we’re not letting go of the, the rest of the world, but very much the Lord had us redirect. And so our team had been working on a systematic strategy with common metrics, for the great commission and getting down to every person, every home, every community, every city, every state. And so we’ve just been seeing some amazing things happen around this idea of completing the great commission in America.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (03:47):
I think it’s so awesome that you’re focusing on the United States because you’re right, this is a mission field. There are so many people in America that need Jesus. I heard someone say yesterday, we went from being a Christian nation to being a post-Christian nation to now being an anti-Christian nation. Was it you who said that? No, no, <laugh> now you, you have an anti-Christian nation in, in, in some aspects of, of American culture now. And so we have to start thinking like missionaries, if we’re going to reach people here in America. And I think that God is speaking the same thing to, to many different ministries. Cause I’ve heard a lot of different ministers that have told me, you know, we really need to focus on America. And so you mentioned metrics in measuring the success of outreaches. Tell me, what are some of those things that you look for to judge if an, if a church or ministry or outreach is being successful?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (04:48):
Well, this really was birthed out of more of a frontier. Mission’s thinking when we think about the unreached and what does it mean to reach? So is it evangelism, is that really just reaching or is it deeper than that? Do you,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (05:01):
Yeah, so I’m an evangelist. And, and you know, the, the, the thing that I like to measure, I actually did my doctoral research on mass evangelism. So I got really deep into the numbers on doing mass crusade and, you know, a lot of evangelists, they, they measure how many people are in the audience and then they they count all the, the fingers and multiply it times 10. That’s right. Sometimes the, the dishonest evangelists, but then not, not us, not us. But you know, you can have numbers where people are like, we got 5 million people saved but there’s only like a million people in the whole country. Right. And, and, and it’s like, where do they all come from? And, and so, I mean, we got, we gotta do look at numbers, honestly. But then often Evangelists will look at decision cards, like how many decision cards were collected and counted. But you’re saying we actually should look beyond just that first stage. I would call it like the first step to someone getting in relationship with the Lord. But we gotta look at beyond that first step and start measuring other metrics of success in evangelism.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (06:08):
And to be honest I’ve, I’ve been an evangelist and rolled in mass evangelism in these circles. I’ve never met an evangelist. Who’s doing mass evangelism that doesn’t care about, follow up discipleship and prayer and all these other pieces. They, they, they just know the gift in the body that they carry. And that is important. We, you know, I was one of those hands, myself that, you know, when I gave my life to Jesus, they said, here’s a Bible, good luck. And you would think, oh no, actually it worked. I began to read the Bible and it changed my life and it, and the holy spirit made up where people didn’t show up. And thankfully the there’s a journey that all of us are on. And I think that’s part of what we’re talking about with measuring the great commission more comprehensively is we recognize the role of prayer that, you know, I was prayed for by my grandmother on a daily basis.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (06:57):
That’s where really the evangelism started, right. Was, and we all know this as evangelists, the, the believers need to adopt those around them. Begin to pray way before an evangelist shows up. This is the real fruit as mass evangelism on a pub on a personal scale, right? Or sorry, other way around personal evangelism on a public scale. So counting prayer is valuable thinking about what if we could pray for everybody by name in a community, and then the next metric. So prayer being the first metric next would be compassion and justice. What if we could demonstrate the love of God through meeting a felt need through building relationship. These are things that are really valuable and prepare the way for other elements and other metrics. So compassion, injustice,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (07:42):
And, and, and compassion. Injustice is really key. I think with connecting with the heart of today’s generation, people really care about justice issues, especially young people and, and in compassion. And I, I think it’s so important to, you know, put food in someone’s belly before you preach the gospel to them.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (08:03):
Yeah. And it’s just natural, you know, you even think about Jesus and what he talked about. He would be measuring in the end judgment time. It was how many cups of cold water, you know, how many meals, how many clothes, how many visits, like these are things that Jesus valued and talked about. And I think these are things that we should care about and Val and measure. And so when we think about compare compassion and justice as two metrics, when we’re saying, what does it mean to truly reach people? They have to get the gospel. I always say, I’m not, I’m not okay with sending people fat, happy, and comfortable and straight to hell, right? <Laugh> like we, we have to move from just compassion and, and, and and justice issues to getting them the gospel, where they can encounter Jesus as a real man that died on a cross for them arose from the dead and that they need to know him and give their lives to him. And so we can measure that as we talked about evangelists do, but then let’s go into Bible engagement because that decision I made in connecting to the word of God was transformative in my life from beginning to teach me, okay, what am I supposed to do as a follower of Jesus? And how does this affect every year of my life? So we have to look at Bible engagement as immeasurable. And
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:16):
So what do you mean by Bible engagement?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (09:18):
So that we’re enga that people are engaging the word of God on a regular basis that changes the way they think and live, right? This is what everybody has to do. And we have a Bible engagement crisis in America, not only outside the church, but in the church as well. And so this is something that we are championing as a measurable for. What does it mean to reach our city is that every person gets engaged with the Bible and that this would be an opportunity to see the word of God become the standard for every category of life. And I think that’s really needed right now,
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (09:51):
When I think about Bible engagement, I really think of like Craig Groeschel, he’s got a great app, the Bible app, and he can tell you how many billions of chapters have been read on the Bible app. Absolutely amazing. I also think of Mart Green from the, the, the Green family who has Hobby Lobby. And I was talking to him one time and he, he said that, that he was really moved by the holy spirit to, to read the Bible every single day, and then to make sure that everyone on earth had the ability to read the Bible in their own language. He became very passionate about helping like Bible translators to, to, to do that. And so I think the Bible engagement is so important.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (10:36):
Yeah. And I think if the only time you read or hear the Bible is on Sunday morning, you got a problem and you’re
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (10:43):
Gonna starve. If that’s the only time you ate all week long, you’d starve.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (10:46):
That’s right. So daily reading and really digesting, not just memorizing, but actually looking at how does this apply to my life is such an important piece. So we need to measure that, and it is a bit ambiguous, but there are amazing tools like Bible project, and many others that are, can quantify how many have watched this? How many have engaged with this? And so that’s an area that we’re gonna continue to develop and develop even better and better tools on how do we help people engage with the word of God, maybe even before they’re a Christian. And so this again is very common in frontier mission stuff, but we need to think about this in America. The last finish line, the fifth finish line is Christian community. That every person would have an opportunity to connect with a Christian community. Now that may be in a lot of different expressions, right?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (11:30):
It could be on Sunday morning, or it could be a small group in somebody’s house. It could be an alpha group that they get to be a part of. There’s so many different expressions. And with the idea of these five finish lines that we can measure and track is that it can look differently everywhere. So a church could do it one way. Another church do another, a city movement can do another way that these are all valued and every, no one’s gonna sit and debate. Well, I don’t think prayer is important. You know, that’s a follower of Jesus. And so these are accepted, but we’re never gonna get everybody agree on the how right. So one particular program, but the, I do believe we can unite the body of Christ around these common metrics and begin to measure community by community and begin to identify where are the empty spots?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (12:13):
You know, where are we not? That’s why we measure where we are not just to pat ourselves in the back and say, we’re doing a great job, though. That’s not horrible, but that we would focus on the least and the lost right. That one lost sheep. And we got a lot more than one right now. So we gotta work hard and get to where the church is focused on. Those that are not showing up on Sunday morning, exclusively, but focused on the ones that are not, and that are really being missed by the gospel. And there’s a lot of them in America.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (12:42):
So let’s talk about how this looks on the ground. If you go to a city here in America and you want to start mobilizing the church to get people involved in, in these different areas how would you go about doing that? What does it look like?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (13:02):
Well, I think the first step is to recognize no one organization can do this alone. The idea of every single person reach with those five finish lines. It’s massive. You just there’s, no one can do it. So I think starting with who are the people that are on mission, right? Like not the ones that don’t believe the great commission, you know, let’s not start there, let’s start with the people that are already on mission, maybe in those different categories, right. The prayer movement. That’s saying, man, God’s not gonna do anything unless we pray. And, and, and, you know, prayer is gonna change hearts. They’re they’re in that camp, right? Saying prayer is, is the deal.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (13:36):
Yeah. Often you find that when people have a calling to a specific area, they think everyone should be involved in that area. And, and so, you know, as an evangelist, I think everyone needs to be out there witnessing every single day, because that’s my gift from God. But people who are gifted in the area of prayer, oh, they, they have such a great passion, just get on their face in a room and, and, and pray before God. And, and I think what we need to do is, is, is have cross pollination between different callings and different giftings to where we can celebrate one another so that the, the prayers are excited about the evangelizers and the, the people who do evangelism are excited about church planting that’s
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (14:20):
Right. Well, this is the body. So that’s obviously where we’re going is, you know, all these different camps that are very siloed, very much passionate about their piece. And so this framework that we’re offering is a way to help bring them together and say, you know what? You’re all right. <Laugh> every one of ’em the, the disciple making movements, the Bible, the, the, you know, that are really going after Bible. And
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (14:39):
Even the interpretive dance people, are they right?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (14:42):
If we have to include them, that’s fine. I’m teasing. But yes, so you have all these different burdens. And again, if we can have a framework that values them all equally and say, Hey, these are all really important in the life of a believer. And especially in reaching the lost, then we can begin to connect with one another. And so what we’re doing is beginning to build alliances really across the country, state by state city, by city that are saying, Hey, we’ll take responsibility for Chicago. We’ll take responsibility for California. And really look over the next 15, 20 years of how do we reach every single person in a geographical space. We have a team out in Kansas, that’s working with the SMS of God, Southern Baptist coming together in this framework to reach every single person in Kansas with these five. So it’s, it’s again, because it’s not a program and we’re not trying to tell ’em how to do it.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (15:32):
We’re really just offering them a, a, a, a table really to say, Hey, here’s, here’s how you can bring mul diverse leaders together to talk about something they all have a passion about, but haven’t maybe been seeing how they fit together and then offer some tools on how they can work together best practices. And so we have a network of about a hundred national partners that are basically set up to serve these local communities as they begin to implement. So we’re just, we’re not trying to do it all ourselves, but I think if we could help bridge silos community by community, across the nation and begin to get those that are on mission. Again, not everybody, but those that are on mission, this remnant and go like Gideon, let’s find the ones with the right mentality and let’s get them together and help them run fast. And I think that’s what God is already doing. So we get to participate with him in it.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (16:27):
So if someone is listening and they want to bring a community of, of people together, a community of believers in, in, in their community how would they get access to some of the, the tools and, and, and help that you guys offer?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (16:43):
So all america.org, as you go to the website, we have really tried to give this away. The, the Lord spoke to me very early on in this and said, write the vision, make it plain, so they can run. And so this really, we have so many tools and resources the strategy guides that will help you think through, as a church, as a community leader, as a small group leader, that will allow you to say, okay, what does it look like for me to take responsibility for the great commission around me? What does it mean to be comprehensive? And then what are some tools and resources that are already out there to help me do it? We’ve found that as people do this, it will go quicker, right? They don’t have to make it up. You don’t have to come up with a Bible engagement strategy. There’s some on our website that are already curated for you by finish line that we’re not playing middleman for just go reach out and do it, or you have a better idea, just go do it. It’s really an opportunity where everybody can build the wall right in front of them. So all america.org is is there’s tools. There’s resources, there’s guides that are on there, that anybody can just go on and use. You don’t have to ask, just go and take it and put your name on it and run with it.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (17:49):
<Laugh> I think that’s awesome. I, I always tell people with my stuff that I give you the copyright, just make sure you copy it. Right. You know, and, and we’re all working for the kingdom of God. So I think that is such a wonderful attitude that you have, that, that you’re developing this material, but then giving it away to whoever wants to use it. That that’s so beautiful. So what you’re doing here with all America comes out of some of your, on the ground practice of doing events in the Caribbean. You you’ve done all events in different parts of the Caribbean, I think all Grenada all. And, and, and so tell me, what are some of the, the things that you saw God do in those countries that now you’re bringing those concepts here to reach people in America?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (18:35):
Well, actually, yeah, the us is our first all initiative. Our, our, our outreach is in the Caribbean in St. Vincent, Barbados, and, and Antigua. Uwhat I learned through that, that I’m applying here in America is just that God is already working in so many places. And this idea of leaning into the strength of the local knowledge and the people that God is placed. And I think often we would come in to try to,udo everything or try to do it ourselves. And I think I’ve really been humbled as I’ve gone along of just seeing,uyou know, again, the, the fact that God’s spirit is empowering people. And if I have hi his spirit and he’s got, and, and they have their spirit, they can do what I can do. And I think this idea of empowering believers,uand coming alongside and serving and coming in as a, as just offering tools,uversus dictating and trying to come in and save the day.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (19:33):
I think that’s really what I’ve learned in the Caribbean of just how amazing these Caribbean leaders are, how they know the word they’re on mission. They still pray, you know, they still do stuff that in America, you call it prayer meeting. It’s not a lot of people showing up in Caribbean and inspiring, and there’s people still doing it. So I think for me, just learning to lean into the, this idea of God is already, you know, giving them everything they need to reach their community. And we, that can come alongside and empower and resource. We have to come in with fear and trembling. We have to come in with really a servant attitude. And I think as we’ve done that, we’ve seen the power of these people, you know, that are empowered and, and really we can help support and resource, but aren’t here to save the day. Aren’t here to be everything. But that we’re really adding value to the long term story of what God’s already been doing in that community.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (20:24):
Let’s talk a little bit more about America and what is going to take to really bring revival here in this nation. I mean, I think that’s, God’s heart, God wants America to be saying, I say, all of America for Jesus, but when you look at the news, I mean, there’s so much division there’s strife between different groups, different political groups, different social groups there’s, there’s accusations of racism and social injustice, which, which are real serious issues that we have to deal with here in America. What do you think it’s gonna take really for us to see another great awakening, a new move of God in this nation? That’s
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (21:05):
Quite the question, but I strangely have an answer. <Laugh> it’s unusual for me to be again, spending so much time praying and talking about America, cuz I’m from America, but I spent a lot of my life overseas. But man, when you take responsibility for something, whether it’s a nation, whether it’s a neighborhood or whatever, God begins to speak to you about it. And you know, as we’ve said yes to America, I’ve been really stunned by the dialogue I’m having with Jesus and by the perspectives that he’s giving me and it’s changed the way I pray. And I know a lot of people may not like this, but honestly what I’m praying for. And I feel God saying to pray for is more shaking. And I think that the idea of we’re gonna have historic revival without great difficulty is is historically uninformed.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (21:52):
And so I think for all of us, even though we may not want that from a Carnell standpoint, I think the best thing for America is greater shaking. And I think we should be crying out to God that we do not end up fat happy and go straight to hell. Right? We do not want to be comfortable and blessed. And we always say, God bless America, but at what cost right at what cost of our eternal salvation, you know? And so I think as I’ve dove into this, you know, we have a lot of people in this country trying to go backwards. And I think man, God has something so much better ahead as I’ve prayed. I feel that he’s exposing where we put our trust. I think there have been many that are not the, the man who’s considered wise by listening and obeying built his house on a rock.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (22:35):
So honestly I’m actually really optimistic about America, which is maybe I’m the minority. But I believe God is about to flip the script. I believe. There is an opportunity for tremendous wholeness and freedom ahead as we deal with our demons, as we really repent and get honest about how we’ve been living and how comfortable we’ve been and you know, and the, you know, there’s a lot of theology that reinforces this comfortability in America. And like I said, I believe God is shaking it. And I’m praying for more shaking because I love it. I love America. I want America to be saved and I think we’ve been so comfortable and so passive. And I think a lot of the persecuted world has been praying for America for a while. So I think those answer, those prayers are about to be answered and are being answered in our day.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (23:26):
Yeah. I, I have a lot of hope for America. I’m actually here in Kansas city for the send, which is happening this weekend. In last night, they had a big tent event as part of their, their pre send events, the, the flood. And it was the, their, the tent was packed full of people. There, there was like 3000 people inside the tent and probably another couple thousand people outside the tent. And many of these are young people with their hands lifted, crying out to God as worshiping God. And, and when I saw the, there is hope for America, there, there is a fire being lit here in America where we’re gonna see God do amazing things. God is not finished with this country.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (24:07):
Amen. And it’s gonna be a different season of being a remnant versus the majority. And I think that’s, like I said, I think it’s healthy. I think it’s gonna refine us. I think it’s gonna help us to not take for granted what Jesus has done for us and what the rest of the world has been like. So again, I am extremely optimistic. I was not when I started, I honestly, just to be full disclosure for you when I was first asked to help out with this thing, I thought maybe it needs judgment. You know, where are the Babylonians? You know, what’s, maybe this would
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (24:37):
Call down fire everybody.
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (24:39):
Yeah. You know what I mean? Like I’m like, oh, shouldn’t really be saved. You know? And I went into the prayer room here in Kansas city and I figured, you know, I go sit front row, a prayer room, be a good place to get an attitude adjustment <laugh>. So I went in, I said, God, you’re asking me to do this, but I don’t want to, and I need you to give me some perspective if we’re gonna go after this. And so in that moment, I got this picture in my mind of a ship and the ship was out on the ocean and it was vertical in the water. Half the ship was above and half the ship was beneath. And as I sat there, I thought that’s an interesting picture to pop into my mind. And then I felt the holy spirit say to me do you believe I could write the ship?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (25:19):
And honestly, as I thought about that picture, I thought that’s, you know, I saw the movie Titanic and I know that’s like the end of the movie. Right. You know? So I’m like, that’s usually, I, I don’t know much about boats, but that’s usually not a good time, you know, to be thinking about writing the ship. But in that moment I really was confronted with that. Do I believe in the power of God? Do I believe that God’s greatness and his power is greater than our weakness and our brokenness. And so in that moment I said, yeah, I believe, I believe you can write the ship. If anybody can, you can. And then he asked me, he said, do you believe the ship can shoot out of the water and land on it and be better than it was before? Do you believe I can do that?
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (25:57):
And I just was like, well, that’s even, <laugh>, that’s a little bit crazier, you know? And again, I, I, I said, okay, this is probably not true question. So I’m gonna stick with the ver answer. And I said, yeah, Lord, I think if anybody can, you can, you can do that. And then he said, this is my will for America. And would you, would you bear the score of believing that? And I don’t even know what that last question’s about, but I said, yes, cuz I was on a roll, but I’m just saying, yeah, I’ll believe that I’ll, I’ll go after that. And again, I think there’s a lot of negativity about America. I think there’s a lot of concern. But like I said, I’m, I’m optimistic. I think it’s gonna surge out of the water, but it’s gonna come. Not in the way that it’s come in the past. I think there’s a different work that God is doing right now. And I think we are on the cusp of it. But we, we have to let go of old mindsets. We have to let go of the past because God has something better in store for us. That’s more healthy and whole than what America was in the past.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (26:53):
Amen. Well, I am with you praying for God to move here in America. I love what you do. I love what all America is doing in the vision for, for reaching this nation. So brother, Joel, thank you for being on the evangelism podcast. I appreciate
Joel McGill – AllAmerica.org (27:07):
It. Yeah. It’s an honor to be here and we, us evangelists gotta stick together. We gotta get as many people sharing the gospel. And so just thankful for you and all you’re doing to just stand for Jesus and get the gospel out there everywhere and everywhere around the world. That’s, that’s listening to this or watching it. We need to pray for America and consider being a missionary to America. We and it’s, it’s not that we don’t ever don’t have everywhere else. We still have to go. But there’s a special moment in time to partner with God in what he’s doing in this nation. And so just again, thank you for Daniel, everything you do. And I’m just excited about as we continue to partner and bring the body of Christ together for the great commission.
Evangelism Coach Daniel King (27:44):
Amen. Thank you brother. Joel, thanks so much for listening today. I am excited about telling people about Jesus and I want to invite you to be a part of helping us to rescue people from hell and take them with us to heaven. There’s two things you can do to help. First of all, can you go find the evangelism podcast on apple iTunes and leave us a positive review by giving a review, you will help other people find these valuable resources about sharing our faith. And second, would you become a financial partner with king ministries? Every single dollar that people give us enables us to lead at least one person to Jesus. And so that means for only $1, you can help start a party in heaven. And so today I want to invite you to become a monthly partner. You can start out for just a dollar, but if God puts it on your heart to do more, of course you can do more. But please go to king ministries.com and become a monthly partner with us today to help us to lead more people to Jesus. Thank you so much. And God bless you
Evangelism Podcast Host (29:05):
For more information about how to share your faith or to financially support our worldwide evangelistic outreaches. Visit king ministries.com. Again that’s king ministries.com.